General Discussion

HockeyMom

(14,337 posts)

213. Biology can make you a mother or a father

Tue Mar 12, 2013, 04:25 PM

Mar 2013

but that alone cannot make you a Mommy or a Daddy. I have seen this far too much in my own personal, and work life. I have to say I am infuriated at this woman for totally disgracing her adoptive parents. They ARE her parents, far more than her BIOLOGICAL parents.

She needs a lot of professional help to understand that fact. Life threw her a curve, but she doesn't know just how lucky she is. Her life could have been far, far worse with her BIOLOGICAL parents. A lot of adult children raised with their biological parents could tell her many a story about that one, including ME. What I cannot understand, as a biological mother and an adult child raised by biological parents, are the people on heer who seem to think this alone is BLISS and an answer to everything. That to me sounds like a right wing, religious, Republican talking point.

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

281 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

N.J. woman refuses to meet daughter she gave up for adoption after being raped over 30 years ago [View all] Liberal_in_LA Mar 2013 OP

Whoa. A difficult situation. I see Foley's side of it, but I also see Penn's interest... Honeycombe8 Mar 2013 #1

i am on the mother's in this. Birthing a child does not a parent make. It holding, touching, kelliekat44 Mar 2013 #59

It's not my place to judge either one. tblue Mar 2013 #63

She hadn't been able to move on because she kept contacting her mother's bio family. southernyankeebelle Mar 2013 #104

Was this statutory rape, or someone the birth mother knew, not a violent nightmare? kentuckyangel Mar 2013 #74

Rape is rape. catbyte Mar 2013 #90

Absolutely 100% wrong. Non-consensual sex is always rape; statutory rape sometimes isn't. Donald Ian Rankin Mar 2013 #151

Two teens having sex is not statutory rape. One of them has to be an adult. Honeycombe8 Mar 2013 #246

I believe that in some jurisdictions of the USA you are legally wrong, although I'm not 100% sure. Donald Ian Rankin Mar 2013 #260

Actually, men can be raped by a woman, although it is extremely rare. GreenStormCloud Mar 2013 #266

Rape is rape. There is no difference. Can't believe you would try to make it sound like there is. idwiyo Mar 2013 #111

Women have been forced to give up their wanted children.... ProudToBeBlueInRhody Mar 2013 #138

I see your point. Didn't think about it because in this case it clearly did not apply. idwiyo Mar 2013 #144

I disagree - see my reply 151, upthread. Donald Ian Rankin Mar 2013 #152

It's like racism in a way Ter Mar 2013 #262

It was definitely rape. She was repeatedly molested by her stepfather. TheOther95Percent Mar 2013 #164

it's thoughtful of you, as an adoptee yourself, to sympathize with the birth mother renate Mar 2013 #222

The documentary is called "Sex in a Cold Climate" and you can watch it on Youtube. smokey nj Mar 2013 #224

Like legitimate rape? Politicub Mar 2013 #280

Interesting dilema Ruby the Liberal Mar 2013 #2

She was raped, and forced by law in 1964 to give birth REP Mar 2013 #41

+1 idwiyo Mar 2013 #76

I understand that Dorian Gray Mar 2013 #92

But once she became aware of the circumstances and of the fact that her tblue37 Mar 2013 #250

and suggesting she should have "gotten (herself) help"? Iris Mar 2013 #273

Any donor in this situation must have their right remain anonymous preserved. Dawson Leery Mar 2013 #3

She wrote a book about it Ruby the Liberal Mar 2013 #4

the fact that she is no longer anonymous was NOT her choice. clearly, the adoption agency or niyad Mar 2013 #8

I was responding to the post above me Ruby the Liberal Mar 2013 #12

What's with that? BainsBane Mar 2013 #13

did you miss the part that she is no longer anonymous, thanks to penn? once that anonymity niyad Mar 2013 #16

Yes, but I still don't understand BainsBane Mar 2013 #18

Maybe she wanted to share her perspective gollygee Mar 2013 #20

very good point niyad Mar 2013 #24

I suppose nt BainsBane Mar 2013 #37

Who knows Tien1985 Mar 2013 #88

Her relationship with the family she wanted to have JDPriestly Mar 2013 #57

+1 JustAnotherGen Mar 2013 #84

This^^^^^^^ riqster Mar 2013 #102

I wonder if anyone has ever documented suicides get the red out Mar 2013 #106

Exactly. Choice is choice and women need to have their choices respected. I feel sorry for the daugh uppityperson Mar 2013 #112

Absolutely. These women went on to have families who may be unaware duffyduff Mar 2013 #143

The daughter had no right to go beyond making the first attempt. LiberalFighter Mar 2013 #5

Exactly, there are online registries for people who want to find Warpy Mar 2013 #35

No right? me b zola Mar 2013 #187

Good lord, this is a horrible story. ProudToBeBlueInRhody Mar 2013 #6

I am an adoptee who was concieved by rape Marrah_G Mar 2013 #7

I am so glad that your experience was a far more positive one. niyad Mar 2013 #9

It's so good to hear that your Control-Z Mar 2013 #10

I was adopted by a great family Marrah_G Mar 2013 #19

I'm also an adoptee Dorian Gray Mar 2013 #94

I also was an adoptee and done thru a Catholic Agency.... truegrit44 Mar 2013 #25

Oh Marrah, I am so happy for you Hekate Mar 2013 #48

And here is the strangest part Marrah_G Mar 2013 #49

I didn't know we had that in common. Behind the Aegis Mar 2013 #56

~hugs~ Marrah_G Mar 2013 #58

I'm so glad that your search had a positive end. I'm really sad that hers was so negative. Rowdyboy Mar 2013 #60

I think it's pretty neat Marrah_G Mar 2013 #61

That you have such a positive attitude is an enormous tribute to you and your mother and her family. Rowdyboy Mar 2013 #62

I think the ones that deserve the most credit are my parents Marrah_G Mar 2013 #64

I had 4 siblings with 9 nieces and nephews -6 adopted, 3 by birth.... Rowdyboy Mar 2013 #67

As it should be!!! Marrah_G Mar 2013 #68

There is no difference. I don't think my family is particularly weird either, we just love each Rowdyboy Mar 2013 #71

I'm torn on this, to be honest. Hayabusa Mar 2013 #11

The question is, whose decision should it be? The mothers or the daughters? Rowdyboy Mar 2013 #65

The mother's. LWolf Mar 2013 #93

All i can think of is one thing. DevonRex Mar 2013 #170

There was one little girl my mother DESPISED in my class get the red out Mar 2013 #214

Oh my. Things were truly DevonRex Mar 2013 #221

It needs to be both Marrah_G Mar 2013 #274

the way that story was written was so emotionally loaded. the birth mother was made niyad Mar 2013 #14

Huh? Jenoch Mar 2013 #15

How does make any sense? Ilsa Mar 2013 #21

poorly written. she was contacted 15 years ago by the person she had given up for adoption niyad Mar 2013 #22

"Throw the cow over the fence some hay". Jenoch Mar 2013 #26

I noticed that. Very poor writing. nt DevonRex Mar 2013 #172

Very sad situation gollygee Mar 2013 #17

you have stated it very well indeed. niyad Mar 2013 #23

+1 well said lunasun Mar 2013 #27

+1,000,000 n/t duffyduff Mar 2013 #33

Exactly. And no matter the reason- closed should remain closed if that's what she wants bettyellen Mar 2013 #38

No one is trying to force her to have a relationship me b zola Mar 2013 #183

The woman is 65 years old...leave her in peace. Maybe Elaine could volunteer to help... Tikki Mar 2013 #28

Closed adoption should mean closed dsc Mar 2013 #29

But you would agree with adoption registries, right? pnwmom Mar 2013 #30

purely voluntary ones yes dsc Mar 2013 #34

No! Closed is closed. If such a birth mother changes her mind, she does it... TheMadMonk Mar 2013 #36

What is wrong with a completely voluntary adoption registry pnwmom Mar 2013 #44

I believe that each party should be able to leave a message for the other... Hekate Mar 2013 #50

Yes -- that's what an adoption registry is. pnwmom Mar 2013 #72

Absolutely it should be the woman's right. duffyduff Mar 2013 #32

Damned skippy. REP Mar 2013 #40

In the DNA age treestar Mar 2013 #42

that is why you get a list of diseases and the like dsc Mar 2013 #43

Women will be less likely to place for adoption... Samurai_Writer Mar 2013 #268

I would think a woman choosing between abortion and adoption dsc Mar 2013 #270

Surrendering for adoption does NOT equal wanting nothing to do with the child! Samurai_Writer Mar 2013 #272

just look at the replys in this thread dsc Mar 2013 #278

That is not what I said Samurai_Writer Mar 2013 #279

It could happen but birth defects typically do not happen for a one generation close relative thing. uppityperson Mar 2013 #113

It takes more than one generation for intermarriage to cause problems jeff47 Mar 2013 #178

I agree Marrah_G Mar 2013 #52

The daughter needs to leave the mother alone duffyduff Mar 2013 #31

Because the daughter is also an unwilling victim deprived of parents without her Ed Suspicious Mar 2013 #79

The daughter was adopted and had been raised by people who ARE her parents. idwiyo Mar 2013 #81

Absolutely! HangOnKids Mar 2013 #110

Deprived of parents? blueamy66 Mar 2013 #109

Deprived of her parents? HockeyMom Mar 2013 #155

Amen blueamy66 Mar 2013 #168

Now your just being ridiculous and argumentative. Force the mother to marry the rapist father? Ed Suspicious Mar 2013 #192

Please blueamy66 Mar 2013 #193

Nope, but I'm an empathetic human. I don't need to walk a mile in another person's shoes to Ed Suspicious Mar 2013 #195

In this case, you need to walk in my shoes blueamy66 Mar 2013 #223

How else would she have her birth PARENTS? HockeyMom Mar 2013 #202

You have no right to decide whether or not this persons longing to attach with her biological parent Ed Suspicious Mar 2013 #191

Closed means Closed HockeyMom Mar 2013 #199

I acknowledge and respect that. I'm simply stating that the child didn't agree to the closed Ed Suspicious Mar 2013 #206

She needs to acknowledge that her adoptive mother HockeyMom Mar 2013 #245

Thank you Ed me b zola Mar 2013 #186

Sometimes life doesn't lend itself to a satisfying Oprah reunion moment. TwilightGardener Mar 2013 #39

I'm wondering why this is a story? snooper2 Mar 2013 #45

it's a story because the Birth Mother wanted a closed adoption, her info should never have been JI7 Mar 2013 #54

Because the daughter and the bio mom are battling it out pnwmom Mar 2013 #70

is a story cause with the advent of social media, the lies of the adoption industry r being exposed me b zola Mar 2013 #194

This case is the Shadow side of all those "happy reunions" TV loves so much Hekate Mar 2013 #46

I agree Marrah_G Mar 2013 #51

that's fucked up, her info should never have been given out JI7 Mar 2013 #47

If she found out her birth father was dead that means she may have known he raped her birth mother.. Tikki Mar 2013 #53

Good post, totally agree. idwiyo Mar 2013 #80

the daughter sounds like a selfish sack of crap fizzgig Mar 2013 #55

Unfortunately she seems to have inherited Spirochete Mar 2013 #180

I was a victim of a crime years ago. I do not want to have anything to do with applegrove Mar 2013 #66

Why would she want to? MrSlayer Mar 2013 #69

Two of my cousins went looking for their birth parents, neither found anything good. Sen. Walter Sobchak Mar 2013 #73

See my post below JoDog Mar 2013 #97

You don't get your kids taken away by the State of California for not mowing your lawn. Sen. Walter Sobchak Mar 2013 #122

Sounds like my daughter's childhood friend HockeyMom Mar 2013 #161

This is a lie me b zola Mar 2013 #189

Excuse me JoDog Mar 2013 #197

Or maybe Ms Penn should get a clue and think twice before harassing a rape victim. idwiyo Mar 2013 #75

Wow Union Scribe Mar 2013 #77

My opinion about this woman is based on her own actions and words. idwiyo Mar 2013 #78

How much choice did the daughter have again? Did she ask to be the spawn of a hideous crime? Ed Suspicious Mar 2013 #82

Don't tell me what I should and shouldn't do. I stand by what I said. idwiyo Mar 2013 #83

the victim is the woman who was raped in this case JI7 Mar 2013 #86

I think Tien1985 Mar 2013 #89

This message was self-deleted by its author HangOnKids Mar 2013 #121

Adopted child here...through Catholic Charities..... blueamy66 Mar 2013 #85

i have heard most adopted kids don't have much interest in birth parents JI7 Mar 2013 #87

That's exactly how I feel Dorian Gray Mar 2013 #95

Exactly. blueamy66 Mar 2013 #107

You have heard propaganda from the billion dollar infant trade industry me b zola Mar 2013 #190

Infant trade industry? WTF? Marrah_G Mar 2013 #275

I was adopted in 1971 Dorian Gray Mar 2013 #91

My brother is a PI JoDog Mar 2013 #96

She mercuryblues Mar 2013 #98

Thank you. Great post. idwiyo Mar 2013 #108

I'm an adoptee Crepuscular Mar 2013 #99

The daughter is horribly selfish and downright stalkerish. geek tragedy Mar 2013 #100

this quote of kathleen foley's is heartbreaking-- and at the heart of every discussion ever held niyad Mar 2013 #114

And here she has this biological daughter blaming geek tragedy Mar 2013 #118

IMO Mr Dixon Mar 2013 #101

I am an adoptee, and for me, curiosity is not a compelling reason to disrupt another person's life. Heidi Mar 2013 #103

I Agree HangOnKids Mar 2013 #116

This message was self-deleted by its author Heidi Mar 2013 #132

Hugs. idwiyo Mar 2013 #148

This message was self-deleted by its author Heidi Mar 2013 #157

i wish, but I think you mistake me for someone else. idwiyo Mar 2013 #160

This message was self-deleted by its author Heidi Mar 2013 #163

OMG. I adore Call Me Wesley! I read all their posts too! idwiyo Mar 2013 #165

The birth mother should have a right to her privacy also get the red out Mar 2013 #105

Response from another first-mother to this sociopath: me b zola Mar 2013 #115

Sociopath? You gotta be kidding me. Shameful. idwiyo Mar 2013 #117

No, this post is shameful me b zola Mar 2013 #120

I agree, your post is shameful and should be deleted. Please, do it now. idwiyo Mar 2013 #123

The bulk of this thread is what is shameful me b zola Mar 2013 #126

WTF are you talking about? You just called a rape survivor a sociopath. That's shameful. idwiyo Mar 2013 #133

Let me clarify: A 16 year old girl was raped. In 1964. Hekate Mar 2013 #140

The Industry get the red out Mar 2013 #156

And now a bunch of outsiders sound like they are getting their kicks.... ProudToBeBlueInRhody Mar 2013 #124

Outsiders? me b zola Mar 2013 #128

Yes, outsiders.... ProudToBeBlueInRhody Mar 2013 #129

The woman you are talking about is NOT a "first mother", please stop calling her that. idwiyo Mar 2013 #135

A pox on you me b zola Mar 2013 #200

You are welcome to hurl any abuse on me. I don't mind. idwiyo Mar 2013 #225

Are you female? Given birth? n/t HangOnKids Mar 2013 #125

I'm a 49 yr old female adoptee who is newly in reunion with my first mother me b zola Mar 2013 #127

Your experience does not give you any right to hurl abuse one someone who doesn't wish anything idwiyo Mar 2013 #136

Adoption is abuse me b zola Mar 2013 #162

So, this woman should have kept the child she did not want to have to start with? idwiyo Mar 2013 #167

Read from this twisted woman's own words, she considered keeping her child me b zola Mar 2013 #174

and exactly where did you see that, because it is certainly NOT in the two linked stories here, niyad Mar 2013 #253

Best of luck to you. Hekate Mar 2013 #169

Your life is not the only life. jeff47 Mar 2013 #184

Wow.... Marrah_G Mar 2013 #277

Not interested after that bit of info. HangOnKids Mar 2013 #166

Of course not me b zola Mar 2013 #176

WTF is this "first mother" crappola? blueamy66 Mar 2013 #264

As much as I empathize with the daughter, you really can't blame the mom Taverner Mar 2013 #119

If you read deeper into the case, the daughter appear to be a real nutter. Xithras Mar 2013 #130

It's becoming clear why that book was written ProudToBeBlueInRhody Mar 2013 #142

Right. What a mess. What a horrible mess. Not surprised about antiabortion/anti adoption. idwiyo Mar 2013 #146

I just checked Amazon for the book & found the reviews were evidently trolled Hekate Mar 2013 #149

If, as a male, I can have an informed opinion on this Shankapotomus Mar 2013 #131

I would imagine so. Bad enough one had to go through it to start with but to be forced to relive ago idwiyo Mar 2013 #139

Got it in one. Thank you, sir. nt Hekate Mar 2013 #150

i have little sympathy for the penn in this case. unblock Mar 2013 #134

It's the mother's decision...the daughter should respect that... joeybee12 Mar 2013 #137

There are lots and lots of comments following the NYDN article about Kathleen Hoy Foley duffyduff Mar 2013 #141

She should at least want to meet her own flesh and blood. beevamp Mar 2013 #145

Enjoy your stay n/t idwiyo Mar 2013 #147

Wow, a non baby-buyer is supposed to be shown the door? me b zola Mar 2013 #177

Can't stand anti-choicers in any way, shape or form. I hope as pro-choice you understand that. idwiyo Mar 2013 #227

They seemed to advocate abortion was preferable to adoption ProudToBeBlueInRhody Mar 2013 #269

One word - batshitcrazy. I had not a slightest idea there are people who seriously advocate that. idwiyo Mar 2013 #271

In 1964 a 16 year old girl was raped. Hekate Mar 2013 #153

When you have a child and give it up for adoption.... ProudToBeBlueInRhody Mar 2013 #154

Insulting "real parent" get the red out Mar 2013 #158

OK, bad choice of word beevamp Mar 2013 #171

The People Who Raised That Person Are Responsible For Her Existence HangOnKids Mar 2013 #173

Post removed Post removed Mar 2013 #182

Sorry it did not work out for you Hekate Mar 2013 #185

If they are convinced that they never want anything to do with the child me b zola Mar 2013 #188

Uhhhh...abortion was illegal when this child was conceived. Gravitycollapse Mar 2013 #209

At the time she was raped abortion was illegal, and very unsafe Hekate Mar 2013 #217

I'm sorry that you are so very, very angry. ProudToBeBlueInRhody Mar 2013 #201

This message was self-deleted by its author Heidi Mar 2013 #175

That's such bull Dorian Gray Mar 2013 #243

No she is not me b zola Mar 2013 #179

That is one of the most appalling statements I have ever read on this board. Hekate Mar 2013 #181

Try growing up knowing that your mother wanted you me b zola Mar 2013 #198

I do not have a problem with blaming institutions for wrongs get the red out Mar 2013 #203

I'm sorry you had that experience Dorian Gray Mar 2013 #244

You disgust me get the red out Mar 2013 #196

Ah, you must be an adopter me b zola Mar 2013 #207

48, married, no kids get the red out Mar 2013 #208

This message was self-deleted by its author Heidi Mar 2013 #159

This message was self-deleted by its author HangOnKids Mar 2013 #205

That is her mother by genetics only. Gravitycollapse Mar 2013 #204

Plenty of women reject their own children. Plenty of women cause horror for those they birthed. haele Mar 2013 #211

Thank you Haele. That's reality. That's the truth. Hekate Mar 2013 #218

Thank you for this post. idwiyo Mar 2013 #230

This thread has devolved into a horrifying mess by 1 poster. xchrom Mar 2013 #210

Is this a common problem? I can't believe what I'm reading in here. Gravitycollapse Mar 2013 #212

I truly feel sorry for that poster ProudToBeBlueInRhody Mar 2013 #216

welcome to DU--some topics seem to cause some posters to go completely off the rails niyad Mar 2013 #254

I wish I could rec this post. smokey nj Mar 2013 #215

Me too. Oh heck, let's just affirm that we are rec'cing this post. Hekate Mar 2013 #219

I'm rec'cin' this post, dammit! smokey nj Mar 2013 #220

I know of at least one real life story that is complicated... Phentex Mar 2013 #226

Biology can make you a mother or a father HockeyMom Mar 2013 #213

Some Facts for Your Consideration Priscilla Sharp Mar 2013 #228

while I do not doubt for a minute what your saying here azurnoir Mar 2013 #229

One cannot prove the negative. Priscilla Sharp Mar 2013 #232

I read was was at the link, you're not proving your case. smokey nj Mar 2013 #234

wow well okay azurnoir Mar 2013 #238

and having read that page, we are supposed to. . .what? hate this woman who was violated niyad Mar 2013 #255

Not taking your word for it, sorry. smokey nj Mar 2013 #231

please cite links, actual, reliable, links to your assertions. otherwise, we can assume what we niyad Mar 2013 #233

You created an account here to post that drivel and expect I should just believe you? idwiyo Mar 2013 #235

Who are you and what is your relationship to this? gollygee Mar 2013 #237

...... smokey nj Mar 2013 #239

I see gollygee Mar 2013 #240

Sure does seem that way. smokey nj Mar 2013 #241

A Catholic Social Services form from the 1960s would mention an incident of rape? theinquisitivechad Mar 2013 #242

Yes, actually Priscilla Sharp Mar 2013 #247

Utter nonsense. No Catholic Charities form from a closed adoption in 1964 msanthrope Mar 2013 #249

care to share the names of those 400 cases. this isn't asking you to prove a negative, but niyad Mar 2013 #261

Stop it. Just bloody stop it. If you had one ounce of integrity you would NOT have stalked this idwiyo Mar 2013 #263

I think you are posting this everywhere FreeState Mar 2013 #248

Yes, here's my review Priscilla Sharp Mar 2013 #251

the only "dark demons weighing her down" appear to be those who think it is their business niyad Mar 2013 #256

This is extremely disingenuous of you Gravitycollapse Mar 2013 #259

Stay away from me, "search angel" blueamy66 Mar 2013 #265

I know, I read those comments--unimaginably vile, for the most part. niyad Mar 2013 #257

Thank you. I read some of them. It's stalking and character assassination. These new poster idwiyo Mar 2013 #258

I want to know who at catholic charities gave penn that information and why we are not seeing niyad Mar 2013 #236

I read something similar that happened to another rape victim some years ago... cynatnite Mar 2013 #252

I have to take the Mom's side on this. GreenStormCloud Mar 2013 #267

I am pro-choice but sometimes the posts I read on here are so sterile liberal_at_heart Mar 2013 #276

I think I identify most with your post. stevenleser Mar 2013 #281