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In reply to the discussion: Iceland campaigns to restrict internet porn [View all]BainsBane
(53,026 posts)117. You aren't acknowledging the evidence
of the criminal prosecutions of people who forced adult women into porn.
For example, in 1999,
an American living in Cambodia, where he maintained a pornographic website,
decided to incorporate into the site what he labeled a Rape Camp featuring
Asian sex slaves used for bondage, discipline, and humiliation.13 Women on
the website were blindfolded, gagged, and/or bound with ropes while being used
in sex acts, and viewers were encouraged to humiliate these Asian sex slaves to
your hearts [sic] content.14 Expanded service featured live interactive bondage
sex shows from Cambodia with pay-per-view access in which customers could
relay requests for torture that would be fulfilled within seconds. The website also
promoted prostitution tourism to men visiting Cambodia.15
The Cambodian Minister of Womens Affairs called for the American to
be charged with violating a Cambodian law prohibiting sexual exploitation and
trafficking of women.16 He was arrested but escaped prosecution through
assistance from the U.S. embassy.17 If this incident had occurred more recently,
the perpetrator might have also been subject to criminal prosecution in the United
States. As of 2008, the criminal provisions of the TVPA, including criminal liability
for severe forms of trafficking in persons, apply extraterritorially
an American living in Cambodia, where he maintained a pornographic website,
decided to incorporate into the site what he labeled a Rape Camp featuring
Asian sex slaves used for bondage, discipline, and humiliation.13 Women on
the website were blindfolded, gagged, and/or bound with ropes while being used
in sex acts, and viewers were encouraged to humiliate these Asian sex slaves to
your hearts [sic] content.14 Expanded service featured live interactive bondage
sex shows from Cambodia with pay-per-view access in which customers could
relay requests for torture that would be fulfilled within seconds. The website also
promoted prostitution tourism to men visiting Cambodia.15
The Cambodian Minister of Womens Affairs called for the American to
be charged with violating a Cambodian law prohibiting sexual exploitation and
trafficking of women.16 He was arrested but escaped prosecution through
assistance from the U.S. embassy.17 If this incident had occurred more recently,
the perpetrator might have also been subject to criminal prosecution in the United
States. As of 2008, the criminal provisions of the TVPA, including criminal liability
for severe forms of trafficking in persons, apply extraterritorially
And more recently
In other cases, trafficking in persons clearly has been involved. For example,
on December 7, 2011, a federal jury in Miami convicted two defendants, Lavont
Flanders Jr. and Emerson Callum, on charges of sex trafficking. A press release
issued by the U.S. Attorneys Office for the Southern District of Florida described
that case as follows:22
The charges spanned from 2006 through July of 2011. During that time,
the defendants had perpetrated a cruel fraud to lure aspiring models to
South Florida by promising them an opportunity to audition for modeling
roles that, it would later turn out, never existed. Once the victims arrived in
Miami, Flanders would instruct them to perform an audition for a purported
alcoholic beverage commercial. During this purported audition, the victims
were asked to promote and drink different brands of alcohol, while Flanders
filmed. Unbeknownst to the victims, the alcoholic beverages Flanders
provided them were laced with benzodiazepines, a common date rape drug.
Once the drugs had taken effect, Flanders would drive the victims to Callum,
who had sex with the victims while Flanders filmed. The defendants then
edited, produced, and sold the footage of the sex acts over the Internet and
to pornography stores and businesses all across the country
on December 7, 2011, a federal jury in Miami convicted two defendants, Lavont
Flanders Jr. and Emerson Callum, on charges of sex trafficking. A press release
issued by the U.S. Attorneys Office for the Southern District of Florida described
that case as follows:22
The charges spanned from 2006 through July of 2011. During that time,
the defendants had perpetrated a cruel fraud to lure aspiring models to
South Florida by promising them an opportunity to audition for modeling
roles that, it would later turn out, never existed. Once the victims arrived in
Miami, Flanders would instruct them to perform an audition for a purported
alcoholic beverage commercial. During this purported audition, the victims
were asked to promote and drink different brands of alcohol, while Flanders
filmed. Unbeknownst to the victims, the alcoholic beverages Flanders
provided them were laced with benzodiazepines, a common date rape drug.
Once the drugs had taken effect, Flanders would drive the victims to Callum,
who had sex with the victims while Flanders filmed. The defendants then
edited, produced, and sold the footage of the sex acts over the Internet and
to pornography stores and businesses all across the country
See the journal article for more.
http://www.protectionproject.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/TPP-J-HR-Civ-Socy_Vol-5_2012-w-cover1.pdf
These cases are not irrelevant to the discussion, no more than low wages in Bangladesh is irrelevant to discussions about patronizing Walmart. Also I have to wonder how much of the "barely legal" porn involves minors.
My view is that if I consume a product I am responsible for the exploitation that produces that product. I am therefore responsible for a great deal of exploitation, though I seek to minimize it where I can by purchasing locally produced items and fair trade when I can, buying grass fed meat, never shopping at Walmart, not using illegal drugs, and not consuming porn. Everyone makes their own choices. There are likely socially responsible choices you make that I don't.
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White-listing is much easier and much more effective than black-listing.
redgreenandblue
May 2013
#2
I don't like that because kids actually should have access to anything non-porn, like
Honeycombe8
May 2013
#102
That IS a low cost, effective way of limiting access to adults who intend to access those sites.
Honeycombe8
May 2013
#104
That's probably one of the things they're going to take a look at. You should pardon the pun.nt
Honeycombe8
May 2013
#103
They're not going to look at it at all, because the genuises who proposed this immediately lost
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#129
"it's not the government's responsibility to regulate consenting adults' sexual choices."
ForgoTheConsequence
May 2013
#3
If there's one truism in this age of electronic media: there's no shortage of ways to get porn.
Honeycombe8
May 2013
#105
Yes you did. Just like those people who said we could not defend women against Sharia.
stevenleser
May 2013
#17
I don't care what you think. You are not going to shut me up on free speech or women's rights
stevenleser
May 2013
#22
That is exactly what you were doing with the passive aggressive accusations against me and the other
stevenleser
May 2013
#26
Nope. But your nasty ad-hominem tactic is exactly that. An attempt to shame into silence
stevenleser
May 2013
#41
You are ignoring, perhaps, the psychological harm done by the exploitive pornographers ...
Sekhmets Daughter
May 2013
#130
That would be a first. I've never met an LGBT person into sex shaming before. I guess its possible.
stevenleser
May 2013
#61
A CIO friend said that people show their true colors when posting anonymously on the internet.
stevenleser
May 2013
#70
I think someone just stole your login and password. There is no ad-hominem in this post...
stevenleser
May 2013
#34
Like I said, it sounds like they already are. The people who proposed it got walloped at the polls.
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#36
But you can't talk about the struggles of females under brutal theocratic regimes
LadyHawkAZ
May 2013
#112
Looks like Iceland is making their own decision on the matter already.
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#16
An active mind is never bored. Kids should learn that. But not with porn. nt
Honeycombe8
May 2013
#106
anyone with any morality would condemn what can and does happen in the porn industry.
Whisp
May 2013
#69
Lemme know when someone walks into a mall and kills 20 people with a DVD of "Rocco does Prague"
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#48
And you would hear the same arguments from people in Texas arguing against their anti-sodomy laws.
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#74
Right, or my right to love/marry someone of the same gender. Or speak out against the government.
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#76
Unlike the clear and obvious connection between a picture of a naked woman and an AK-47.
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#79
Well then you come up with some ironclad non-Burgeresque definition of "porn"
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#111
I'm saying that if you want to create some standard for "degrading" that isn't Potter Stewart's
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#174
A "clear" connection is disputable. But I think everyone here would agree that human trafficking
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#65
And porn isn't monolithic. But again, those are arguments for a healthy domestic porn industry.
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#124
We agree that human trafficking and poverty are both terrible, and should be fought vigorously.
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#96
More than anything, those are arguments for a healthy, vibrant, successful domestic porn industry.
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#123
Fair enough. But it might be worth going past the propaganda to see the regulations already in place
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#157
related to those awful facebook vids and pics and confessions. the young are marinated in this shit
Whisp
May 2013
#73
the "young are acting like shitty animals"? Really? Is that why violent crime is down?
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#77
I also don't believe these hyperbolic examples are indicative of wide trends.
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#109
I still don't buy the "culture in crisis" narrative. What are the exact numbers?
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#126
Is Sexy Baby the one where the woman was having labiaplasty because of something her boyfriend said?
redqueen
May 2013
#135
Couldn't the same argument be made for ANY cosmetic plastic surgery? ...
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#142
There are two numbers, the rate of increase and the number of procedures period.
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#158
If the focus is on filtering the most extreme, violent material then perhaps this isn't a bad thing.
nomorenomore08
May 2013
#57
Reading this thread, the line between reasonable people and fanatic jerks looks very clear indeed.
2ndAmForComputers
May 2013
#63
Well, the Faurisson thing is certainly ironic, given the topic at hand.
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#132
Iceland's not doing anything, yet-And the folks who proposed it immediately got drubbed at the polls
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#137
I agree that it's subjective. And I certainly agree that the MacKinnon approach, philosophically,
nomorenomore08
May 2013
#138
No doubt. The VU were one of my entry points (at about 18/19 - I'm 28 now) to the more far-out
nomorenomore08
May 2013
#143
Judging by 'Rock'n'Roll Animal' I'm sure he could put on a hell of a show in his day.
nomorenomore08
May 2013
#146
Parents have the right to have their children protected from porn, if they choose.
Honeycombe8
May 2013
#110
I'm not even thinking of sex/nudity per se, myself. I think we Americans tend to be a little uptight
nomorenomore08
May 2013
#116
I guess because those who consume it are, to a certain extent, the only ones aware of it.
nomorenomore08
May 2013
#131
Still, people like what they like. Even if censorship were a good idea, it's not feasable.
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#133
Of course. I think you and I agree far more, in the end, than we disagree.
nomorenomore08
May 2013
#134
"..material easily accessible from "mainstream" sites is enough to freak out even somebody like me,
redqueen
May 2013
#139
I'm pretty desensitized, but not (I'd like to think) to real-life suffering.
nomorenomore08
May 2013
#150
To be blunt, banning porn is a dumb idea by foolish people who don't know how the internet works.
Kurska
May 2013
#161
To be fair, I'm pretty sure Iceland's proposed law wasn't a blanket porn ban.
nomorenomore08
May 2013
#162
Changing the criteria for what porn they want to ban doesn't at all make it any more possible
Kurska
May 2013
#164
I've got a better idea. Why don't they just enforce their laws against porn like we do?
KamaAina
May 2013
#173
Ban porn, force people into 2 years of mandatory labor, and sanitize the English language...
Pragdem
May 2013
#177
Because if consenting adults fuck in front of a camera and other consenting adults watch it
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#181
Well then I guess you've made a compelling case, there, for censoring porn.
Warren DeMontague
May 2013
#184