General Discussion

krispos42

(49,445 posts)

109. The idea behind "Stand Your Ground" is sound

Wed Jul 3, 2013, 10:36 AM

Jul 2013

The alternative is to force intended victims to try to turn and escape a threat, which puts them at a distinct disadvantage. Remember, violent criminals are generally young. Putting the burden of fleeing on people that might not be able to flee quickly is a terrible idea. Imagine older people, people not in good shape (lots of us out there) or having to shepherd somebody like that away from one or more young violent criminals. Or a dad or a mom trying to retreat carrying kids or something.

Or imagine whether or not you could have fled from the attacker you had to shoot being decided by a jury a year later. Or how a prosecutor

The wording of the various laws are doubtless different state by state, and some are probably better than others.

Having said that, I'll note that Zimmerman's defense is not based on SYG, but on regular justifiable-homicide laws, in which you confess to killing somebody but try to convince a jury that is was justified by the circumstances.

I don't support Zimmerman. Martin was standing his ground against an unknown person pursuing him. Zimmerman needs to be in jail.

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Anybody Else Amazed At the Amount Of Support For Zimmerman And Stand Your Ground ??? [View all] WillyT Jul 2013 OP

I haven't seen any support for it; in fact, I just heard senseandsensibility Jul 2013 #1

Psst... look around... WillyT Jul 2013 #2

Do I have to? senseandsensibility Jul 2013 #4

There are plenty of posters here that think Zim Ilsa Jul 2013 #6

Unfortunately, it isn't a matter of what he deserves, it is a matter of what the jury JDPriestly Jul 2013 #41

I agree with the Rev Mojorabbit Jul 2013 #29

Apparently, if you are black and unarmed, you cannot stand your ground against bushisanidiot Jul 2013 #110

There are a lot of purple people here these days. Kinda hard to tell them from Great Bill Piles of leveymg Jul 2013 #3

since i knew one had a lot to do with the other, no i'm not surprised JI7 Jul 2013 #5

You noticed too. n/t JimDandy Jul 2013 #32

Bigots and guns are closely related. Walk around a gun store/show. Hoyt Jul 2013 #7

lol. when you you point a finger, there are 3 pointed right back at you! galileoreloaded Jul 2013 #25

Yes. nt alsame Jul 2013 #8

Yes, I am. HappyMe Jul 2013 #9

Actually .... etherealtruth Jul 2013 #10

I'm not amazed. Racism is alive and well. mwrguy Jul 2013 #11

I'm not getting the racism angle Boudica the Lyoness Jul 2013 #12

If people call something racist they don't have to discuss the actual law/issue The Straight Story Jul 2013 #22

And sadly, Trayvon did not outrun Zimmerman. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #42

Should I assume from your flag that you're across the pond? Just Saying Jul 2013 #34

Your first paragraph sums up the flaw with this discussion joeglow3 Jul 2013 #100

What the jury believes both in witness testimony and of Zimmerman's Just Saying Jul 2013 #119

not really with all the support ive seen here for obamas spying on americans nothing surprises me bowens43 Jul 2013 #13

I'm not sure that all of his supporters NoGOPZone Jul 2013 #14

What gets me is they dont believe Martin had this same right. DearAbby Jul 2013 #15

You seriously find the words "no problem" to be threatening? Llewlladdwr Jul 2013 #18

Yes DearAbby Jul 2013 #21

Why do you feel Z identifying as part of the neighborhood watch would have defused the situation? Llewlladdwr Jul 2013 #23

It would be good if people in the neighborhood watch who actually patrol around JDPriestly Jul 2013 #43

You do understand that a neighborhood watch person is not actually a law officer, right? Llewlladdwr Jul 2013 #49

Thats why the dumb ass actually explaining he was part of neighborhood watch and why jmg257 Jul 2013 #96

When he was asked "Do you have a problem?" DearAbby Jul 2013 #46

Why do you think Z announcing that he was on the neighborhood watch... Llewlladdwr Jul 2013 #53

Maybe because it would help Travon understand why some strange guy was following him? jmg257 Jul 2013 #94

May Trayvon could have said, I am just walking home instead of attacking someone joeglow3 Jul 2013 #102

Exactly, that is why when Zimmer was asked by his victim, he should have told the truth. jmg257 Jul 2013 #105

And Trayvon should have said "Cool. I am just walking home. Thanks" joeglow3 Jul 2013 #107

There is no other point - Zimmer was actively pursuing Travon. He obviously lied to his intention, jmg257 Jul 2013 #108

But we DO know what happened. jmg257 Jul 2013 #106

It works both ways. DearAbby Jul 2013 #120

And ceonupe Jul 2013 #69

If Zimmerman had said that gollygee Jul 2013 #101

Yes! nt frogmarch Jul 2013 #16

Yes. Iggo Jul 2013 #17

It's often shocking to find out others disagree with you. Llewlladdwr Jul 2013 #19

Why how dare they since I know I Duckwraps Jul 2013 #24

There is a video on DU explaining the contradictions in Zimmerman's story. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #44

Can you direct me to where? Llewlladdwr Jul 2013 #45

Give me a minute. I will find it. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #48

Here. Sorry for the delay. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #50

Checking it out now. Llewlladdwr Jul 2013 #54

Circumstantial evidence certainly does treestar Jul 2013 #91

Gun humpers always defend other gun humpers no matter what. forestpath Jul 2013 #20

but not when a gun humper is a dog humper. galileoreloaded Jul 2013 #27

I haven't encountered anyone on DU Shankapotomus Jul 2013 #26

Too many guns out there are burning holes in too many pockets Warpy Jul 2013 #28

That right there Nails It. Hoyt Jul 2013 #36

+100 billh58 Jul 2013 #112

spillover from the Gungeon ? Trajan Jul 2013 #30

Zimmerman =/= stand your ground Lizzie Poppet Jul 2013 #31

The "self defense" he's claiming is essentially stand your ground BS. Hoyt Jul 2013 #38

Agreed, and I think Zimmerman's a murderer... Lizzie Poppet Jul 2013 #55

Nope, OP is correct. It's like gun folks acting like there is a big difference between Hoyt Jul 2013 #75

There *is* a big difference between a clip and a magazine. Llewlladdwr Jul 2013 #82

They feed bullets to your beloved guns. SYG just expands self defense Hoyt Jul 2013 #93

How about "ammunition feeding devices". That should cover them all... jmg257 Jul 2013 #95

That association the OP made is demonstrably false, as shown in this very thread. Lizzie Poppet Jul 2013 #97

It is the same self defense law you would find in any state. hack89 Jul 2013 #99

I'm sure you have read every state's so you will know when you can pull your guns wherever you are. Hoyt Jul 2013 #113

I don't carry in public - I have no need to. nt hack89 Jul 2013 #117

It's been an eye opening experience. nt Demo_Chris Jul 2013 #33

It is always all about the gun and immigration. Everything. That's how the BushPaul's play. graham4anything Jul 2013 #35

Don't forget that Martin O'Malley (45) passed the most comprehensive gun legislation in the US. madinmaryland Jul 2013 #39

actually, NYC has the best. However, watch out for the Cornyn poison pen pill amendment. Danger in graham4anything Jul 2013 #88

Blame Kennedy ceonupe Jul 2013 #70

Yes Gemini Cat Jul 2013 #37

Not really. I remember the Joe Horn case in Texas. aikoaiko Jul 2013 #40

My suggestion is to allow people to carry their guns and to own guns as they wish, but JDPriestly Jul 2013 #47

That makes sense. Gun crowd should listen. Hoyt Jul 2013 #51

Wow. Llewlladdwr Jul 2013 #57

Not if it is in their homes. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #63

Hmmm...so self defense with a firearm is only permitted in one's home? Llewlladdwr Jul 2013 #65

Yes. It is unlikely that a woman being raped is going to be able to use a gun on the rapist. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #79

Let me make sure I understand. Llewlladdwr Jul 2013 #81

I am suggesting that. Perhaps if people want there could be an exception for rape, but JDPriestly Jul 2013 #84

Wow. Llewlladdwr Jul 2013 #86

That is fucking sick... Pelican Jul 2013 #87

"self-defense should not be permitted as a defense if you killed someone with a gun" Lizzie Poppet Jul 2013 #58

Anything but a gun. Llewlladdwr Jul 2013 #61

I think this would discourage people from carrying guns, especially criminals. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #64

I disagree. I don't think criminals would give it a second thought. Lizzie Poppet Jul 2013 #68

As I pointed out, armed robbery gets a stiffer sentence than just robbery. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #78

You think criminals OwnedByCats Jul 2013 #77

I don't think I am a candidate for carrying a gun. I am extremely nearsighted JDPriestly Jul 2013 #85

How many murderers claim self defense? hack89 Jul 2013 #103

Being able to understand how the law works is not racist. dkf Jul 2013 #52

Not really... Scootaloo Jul 2013 #56

A friend said that the decision from this trial will be whether or not it's fair game to kill black Fire Walk With Me Jul 2013 #59

Astonished and disgusted. PDJane Jul 2013 #60

I do not support Zimmerman davidn3600 Jul 2013 #62

It seems to be growing as the trial goes on... Pelican Jul 2013 #66

The only thing that amazes me is my dogs bowel regularity. Inkfreak Jul 2013 #67

Am I a racist if I don't hate castle doctrine? flvegan Jul 2013 #71

You might be if you embrace "stand your ground and similar crud," though. Hoyt Jul 2013 #80

I do notice how CNN and msnbc have dialed back the blind pro travon stance ceonupe Jul 2013 #72

I can't say what I want to say about the pro-Zimmerman crowd on DU. Arugula Latte Jul 2013 #73

Also remember the obvious low post count trolls Moses2SandyKoufax Jul 2013 #74

Yes, and you are so right. MotherPetrie Jul 2013 #76

Yes, and it makes me sick to my stomach. I want to tell them to wake up! What if it were your kid? bravenak Jul 2013 #83

I wish I was DonCoquixote Jul 2013 #89

Amazed and thoroughly disgusted. nt DLevine Jul 2013 #90

On DU or elsewhere? rucky Jul 2013 #92

You mistake support for the judicial process for support of Zimmerman joeglow3 Jul 2013 #98

Who is supporting Stand your Ground? naaman fletcher Jul 2013 #104

The idea behind "Stand Your Ground" is sound krispos42 Jul 2013 #109

Yes. Myrina Jul 2013 #111

I am totally sickened by the support..either they are racists or see Trayvon as an inanimate object. Tikki Jul 2013 #114

Yes and it's disgusting. tallahasseedem Jul 2013 #115

There's a lot of confusion between support for Zimmerman and support for the justice system. lumberjack_jeff Jul 2013 #116

yeah. seems to be mostly the gun folks too... dionysus Jul 2013 #118