General Discussion

ProSense

(116,464 posts)

18. I'll repeat a previous point

Wed Jul 17, 2013, 08:35 PM

Jul 2013

Bush's illegal spying was exposed in 2005 by Thomas Tamm. FISA has always been controversial and challenged by civil liberties groups and some lawmakers (http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023009232). The notion that criticism of Snowdens actions that led him to reveal U.S. state secrets to other countries and find himself stuck in Russia have anything to do with anyone's opinion ongoing debate about NSA domestic programs is hogwash

Don't expect people to overlook Snowden's actions overseas simply because there are "doubts" about the program. Not going to happen.

Snowden is a delusional and self-important clown. He and Greenwald (and their supports) have done everything to help make the story about them.

First, Greenwald announces that he has enough information to bring down the U.S.

Snowden follows by declaring he's immune to torture.

He's applying for temporary asylum in Russia.

Doesn't get any more bizarre than that. Well...

Edward Snowden Declares Himself Torture-Proof
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023275112

If Snowden's case as a whistleblower is so strong, why is he afraid to face the consequences?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023236549

Sen. Tester Calls On Snowden To Return To America To ‘Face The Music’
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023281426

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Post here to admit you were wrong about Snowden and NSA [View all] RobertEarl Jul 2013 OP

Good luck with that. ohheckyeah Jul 2013 #1

Snowden is both brush Jul 2013 #2

Nothing changes that. liberal N proud Jul 2013 #5

He didn't. Luminous Animal Jul 2013 #15

Yes, he did. When he revealed that the US had managed to penetrate cstanleytech Jul 2013 #51

The US should not be "penetrating computers" at all. Civilization2 Jul 2013 #69

Way OT, but I was reminded of a great sign I saw at an HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #86

To bad we live in the real world. nt cstanleytech Jul 2013 #114

thanks for the non-statement. Too bad logic escapes you. Civilization2 Jul 2013 #116

I didnt say I disagreed with you Civil, just that its to bad we live in the real world. cstanleytech Jul 2013 #117

I'm pretty sure ohheckyeah Jul 2013 #125

lolz Civilization2 Jul 2013 #140

That's pretty chickenshit compared to sending big chunks of US manufacturing capacity there, includi eridani Jul 2013 #99

Excellent point. n/t dreamnightwind Jul 2013 #118

Did you see the 60 Minutes ohheckyeah Jul 2013 #121

There's my thought in a nutshell. 7962 Jul 2013 #27

What do they want bad enough to try and bring down the US ? lumpy Jul 2013 #35

China already has anything we ever had that was of value -- except our land. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #73

I agree. He did a good thing but is now continuing to do bad things, pnwmom Jul 2013 #37

Which is the dog and which is the pony in that show? Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2013 #66

good question pnwmom Jul 2013 #68

yes, good question exlrrp Jul 2013 #101

I noticed a couple of posters have been absent today. Apophis Jul 2013 #3

Waiting for the new talking points to come back from focus group testing. n/t backscatter712 Jul 2013 #41

Yep. Apophis Jul 2013 #42

It's been a bunch of Nonsense Android3.14 Jul 2013 #65

Did you miss me? randome Jul 2013 #43

You are being silly again Android3.14 Jul 2013 #98

Address the issues I listed in post #30. randome Jul 2013 #100

Sorry, kid Android3.14 Jul 2013 #102

^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ bvar22 Jul 2013 #129

Address the issues I listed in post #30. That's an honest request. randome Jul 2013 #130

In other words there is no evidence, and you don't need no stinkin' evidence. bornskeptic Jul 2013 #132

Bullshit MannyGoldstein Jul 2013 #4

This is your 3rd way? RobertEarl Jul 2013 #8

It is I, Third Way Manny MannyGoldstein Jul 2013 #39

Do you need beer and travel money? grasswire Jul 2013 #127

Sauternes and Wall Street Money MannyGoldstein Jul 2013 #128

you still have morons here that insist evo morales' plane wasn't denied airspace.. frylock Jul 2013 #6

+ a gazillion. nt Mojorabbit Jul 2013 #10

Lol! Trying to sell piss as lemonade. The tenacity is something else and not good either n/t Catherina Jul 2013 #11

When one makes ice cream out of horse shit hootinholler Jul 2013 #17

Lol! n/t Catherina Jul 2013 #56

Not only is shit being sold as chocolate, woo me with science Jul 2013 #81

But they have the flight map! backscatter712 Jul 2013 #85

That still makes me chuckle... ohheckyeah Jul 2013 #122

Too true. nt Poll_Blind Jul 2013 #115

But...but...libertarian! Chinese spy! China hates freedom! I mean Russian spy! RUSSIA hates freedom! NuclearDem Jul 2013 #7

Yep. He had BOXES! Ahaa! RobertEarl Jul 2013 #9

You forgot he gave money to ohheckyeah Jul 2013 #12

And ratfucker n/t hootinholler Jul 2013 #14

Ewwwwwwwwww.... ohheckyeah Jul 2013 #16

A certain group is certainly ratfucking here on DU... n/t backscatter712 Jul 2013 #80

Wait a minute....pole dancing girlfriend??? I may need to do more research........ 7962 Jul 2013 #28

And here's a map that PROVES it! woo me with science Jul 2013 #82

Did someone jam Keyser Soze's phone? hootinholler Jul 2013 #13

I'll repeat a previous point ProSense Jul 2013 #18

And now Sensenbrenner is pitching in too. ucrdem Jul 2013 #22

See that ucrdem? RobertEarl Jul 2013 #25

ProSense is responding to your OP, which is "about Snowden and NSA," ucrdem Jul 2013 #29

+1000 Katashi_itto Jul 2013 #92

But here is the BEST point -- it did do something more than 2005... Pholus Jul 2013 #26

Yes, this is what is most significant, proof of the NSA's surveillance siligut Jul 2013 #83

+1000 dreamnightwind Jul 2013 #119

Dang, I thought you were making a public confession. ucrdem Jul 2013 #19

Yes. I confess RobertEarl Jul 2013 #23

Can you point out these alleged falsehoods you speak of? ucrdem Jul 2013 #24

Post removed Post removed Jul 2013 #52

Evidence. randome Jul 2013 #30

Heh RobertEarl Jul 2013 #36

Cite the evidence that supports the claims listed above. randome Jul 2013 #38

FOR THE FIRST TIME, WE SEE AN ACTUAL FISA WARRANT Th1onein Jul 2013 #59

Not only is it a legal warrant but the courts have ruled for decades that metadata is not protected. randome Jul 2013 #67

Let's see.....what number was that under the Apologists' Manifesto? Th1onein Jul 2013 #79

What, you deny that it's legal? randome Jul 2013 #97

I very much doubt that it's legal, except in secret interpretations of the law. Th1onein Jul 2013 #141

Don't get me started on traffic signals. NCTraveler Jul 2013 #103

What is this thing you call...'fun'? randome Jul 2013 #137

Heh. zappaman Jul 2013 #48

No evidence? RobertEarl Jul 2013 #54

Heh. zappaman Jul 2013 #55

No evidence, my ass. Th1onein Jul 2013 #61

Your denial is too complete to be reasoned with. reusrename Jul 2013 #88

Yeah, that Utah facility storing all data in the world before it's built. randome Jul 2013 #95

This stuff is just too advanced for some folks. reusrename Jul 2013 #108

I disagree with so many things in this post I don't know where to begin. dreamnightwind Jul 2013 #120

Pick one. randome Jul 2013 #131

Nope, I pick every single word dreamnightwind Jul 2013 #136

There are several useless liars here who will never admit they were wrong DisgustipatedinCA Jul 2013 #20

I don't see anyone calling you names. Funny how that one-way street works, huh? randome Jul 2013 #31

It's a laugh riot. DisgustipatedinCA Jul 2013 #33

+1000 CakeGrrl Jul 2013 #34

Racist Paul-bots. Oh no that never happened. Warren Stupidity Jul 2013 #93

You're right, I have seen 'Paul-bot' applied. Not by me but by some. randome Jul 2013 #94

Not in their job descriptions either Matariki Jul 2013 #77

Not many takers huh? Oh well, not too surprising. ~nt 99th_Monkey Jul 2013 #21

My, how the political winds can shift Gman Jul 2013 #32

OK, I was wrong about Snowden and NSA carolinayellowdog Jul 2013 #40

Not sure you'd find many pro-NSA DUers. randome Jul 2013 #47

Really? shawn703 Jul 2013 #44

Impossible, some DUers are never wrong. Rex Jul 2013 #45

*posting* NOT wrong. SNOWDEN/GREENWALD got something wrong 'bout them. n/t UTUSN Jul 2013 #46

What about this? RobertEarl Jul 2013 #49

Well, I love CONYERS, and almost ALL Dems, but there's something FISHY UTUSN Jul 2013 #53

It isn't about Snowden RobertEarl Jul 2013 #58

Since this thread is back p.1, I'll respond UTUSN Jul 2013 #104

Separate the action from the actors RobertEarl Jul 2013 #106

O.K., we're at the go-our-separate-ways point, I hope amicably. I really thought I was clear UTUSN Jul 2013 #107

That's what I took from your post RobertEarl Jul 2013 #109

Gosh, not to flog a dead horse, but I SAID I NEVER separate the two and won't start now. Please. nt UTUSN Jul 2013 #112

The actor is the NSA dreamnightwind Jul 2013 #126

Snowden STOLE classified government documents, his publicly admitted crimes are felonies. Tx4obama Jul 2013 #50

You should go arrest him RobertEarl Jul 2013 #57

Incontrovertible proof that John Conyers is of the opinion cheapdate Jul 2013 #72

You're pissed now that they have the EVIDENCE to support their lawsuit, Th1onein Jul 2013 #62

RIGHT FUCKING NOW!!1 frylock Jul 2013 #63

We should boycott Russia. L0oniX Jul 2013 #75

I'm throwing my vote in with deputizing you and making you go arrest him. Gravitycollapse Jul 2013 #89

well, rightwingers don't have a monopoly on dishonest dumbasshood stupidicus Jul 2013 #60

I think the most interesting story is why Snowden underthematrix Jul 2013 #64

A man who has no problem with Android3.14 Jul 2013 #138

K&R. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #70

Not one of those fuckers will ever admit they are wrong. N.T. Warren Stupidity Jul 2013 #71

It does appear that way RobertEarl Jul 2013 #78

How would they collect a paycheck if they conceded the talking points they're paid to be spamming?nt backscatter712 Jul 2013 #84

I was wrong. Whisp Jul 2013 #74

I was so hoping you were taking this OP in a different direction Godhumor Jul 2013 #76

Congresspeople read DU for propaganda? CakeGrrl Jul 2013 #87

Snowden broke some laws, that's a given RobertEarl Jul 2013 #90

You still clutching to the "whistleblower" facade? great white snark Jul 2013 #91

Yes marions ghost Jul 2013 #105

du rec. xchrom Jul 2013 #96

I understand the sentiment and where it is coming from (I think), but I'm not HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #110

Agreed RobertEarl Jul 2013 #111

This sounds about right Android3.14 Jul 2013 #139

Post here if you've ever used two DU accounts at the same time... SidDithers Jul 2013 #113

That's all you've got? ohheckyeah Jul 2013 #124

I'm sure you made a lot of people angry with this thread Hydra Jul 2013 #123

So, lawmakers "voice doubts"? Proud Liberal Dem Jul 2013 #133

According to some posters here, those 'doubts' are the same thing as 'proof'. randome Jul 2013 #134

It is not about Snowden RobertEarl Jul 2013 #142

DURec. bvar22 Jul 2013 #135