General Discussion

Ms. Toad

(38,421 posts)

109. Actually - many of these are non-profit entities.

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 03:19 PM

Dec 2013

Cleveland Clinic (http://my.clevelandclinic.org/about-cleveland-clinic/overview/who-we-are/mission-vision-values.aspx )
Mayo clinic (http://www.mayoclinic.org/about/ )
Johns Hopkins (http://health.usnews.com/best-hospitals/area/md/johns-hopkins-hospital-6320180/details )
Stanford (https://ogc.stanford.edu/hospital-legal-information )

Just to name the first four medical centers which I know have Integrative Medicine/Complementary and Alternative Medicine (CAM) departments - none of which are for-profit entities.

And - by your logic, no insurance company should be willing to pay for it. My mainstream insurance company allows approximately two visits per week of CAM.

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I keep getting told woo is "harmless..." [View all] Archae Dec 2013 OP

Clearly this one was... n/t hlthe2b Dec 2013 #1

Woo can kill. We lost a kid to measles here in the Twin Cities. MineralMan Dec 2013 #2

Do you have equal concern about the thousands that die each year trusting mainstream medical care? Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #3

Mainstream medicine usually has a way to correct mistakes. Archae Dec 2013 #7

I took Darvon ONCE. I almost died. I passed out, and woke up the next day, Pathwalker Dec 2013 #14

I tool Darvon for post-surgical pain auntsue Dec 2013 #34

I took it and went into Seizure hollysmom Dec 2013 #52

Tell that to those that died. Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #18

You might want to do some fact checking. Ms. Toad Dec 2013 #26

Several months ago, I saw a website selling laetrile as a cancer cure. Archae Dec 2013 #67

Now there's a spectacularly silly and unfair comparison. Donald Ian Rankin Dec 2013 #10

This is not about riskier treatments. Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #16

Medical mistakes kill people, "alternative" medicine just kills them outright. Humanist_Activist Dec 2013 #23

Mainstream medicine is responsible for far more injuries and death than alternative medicine. Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #28

You seem to be confusing mistakes with treatment... Humanist_Activist Dec 2013 #38

You seemed confused with how often medical treatments applied as intended maim and kill. Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #54

Tell me about these alternatives that actually work, and give me the clinical trial data please... Humanist_Activist Dec 2013 #65

"Despite your bias, there are alternatives methods that work" D23MIURG23 Dec 2013 #85

"Mainstream medicine" is effective, "alternative medicine" is ineffective. D23MIURG23 Dec 2013 #84

Actually - it doesn't always work. Ms. Toad Dec 2013 #31

You seem to be confusing "alternative" medicine, which isn't medicine at all... Humanist_Activist Dec 2013 #39

Not at all. Ms. Toad Dec 2013 #44

OK, in order... Humanist_Activist Dec 2013 #68

Did you bother to check out the US government website I pointed you to - Ms. Toad Dec 2013 #80

No offense, but just because the government supports it isn't a reason to think it is legitimate... Humanist_Activist Dec 2013 #99

You are notably silent about the Cleveland Clinic Ms. Toad Dec 2013 #107

My "simplistic" point is this, where is the fucking evidence, apparently, just because.... Humanist_Activist Dec 2013 #108

Glad to see you finally acknowledge the point I've been making. Ms. Toad Dec 2013 #111

+1 D23MIURG23 Dec 2013 #82

So -- what do you propose auntsue Dec 2013 #35

Apparently, according to Big Blue Marble, you have a better chance at praying... Humanist_Activist Dec 2013 #40

Excuse me, where did I mention praying? Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #56

So, when do you expect to die? Humanist_Activist Dec 2013 #72

This is at best a an irrational response. N/T Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #78

I am happy to hear you saved your life. Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #55

Actually, you said medical malpractice kills a lot of people, your problem with... Humanist_Activist Dec 2013 #71

It is mainstream research that says medicine kills Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #77

At least big pharma is regulated a little bit, do you trust the big alternative medicine people? Humanist_Activist Dec 2013 #100

Have you any idea how manipulated drug trials are? Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #114

Exactly-- sort of like the best surgeons having a higher rate of patient deaths. Marr Dec 2013 #104

LOL,so proven science done incorrectly = no science done correctly. Wow, WTF. n-t Logical Dec 2013 #45

Science done incorrectly can be very dangerous. Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #58

But woo with no science is better? Average life span only 100 years.... Logical Dec 2013 #59

I would suggest you really do not know what you are talking about. Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #61

Link to your best study! nt Logical Dec 2013 #62

Here you go: Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #63

That's not a scientific study, if you are that ignorant of science, no wonder you... Humanist_Activist Dec 2013 #70

My point was that alternative medicine is being incorporated in modern Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #76

From 2006? CBS? How about peer reviewed study proving alternative.... Logical Dec 2013 #79

Apparently quite a few hospitols are satisfied that these Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #83

You mean a profit-seeking corporation will add additional treatments to your bill? jeff47 Dec 2013 #92

Actually - many of these are non-profit entities. Ms. Toad Dec 2013 #109

The practitioners are very concerned with profit, even when the hospital isn't. jeff47 Dec 2013 #110

The practitioners in at least one of those facilities Ms. Toad Dec 2013 #112

Those "treatments" are dirt cheap. Marr Dec 2013 #105

You do not have a clue of how integrated these services are or how much they help. Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #115

And you do not have a scrap of scientific evidence that they are effective. Marr Dec 2013 #117

Congratulate yourself on your deep smugness. Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #118

Lots of personal insults, but no evidence. Marr Dec 2013 #119

Oh really, you accuse me of personal insults and then call me a liar. Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #120

This message was self-deleted by its author Big Blue Marble Dec 2013 #4

If "woo" is a belief predicated on the imaginary... LanternWaste Dec 2013 #5

You're either missing a very obvious distinction, or pretending to do so for rhetorical effect. Donald Ian Rankin Dec 2013 #11

How is alternative medicine supernatural? kwassa Dec 2013 #48

The imaginary is imaginary. Politics, religion and philosophy exist no where but our own minds... LanternWaste Dec 2013 #97

Are there any studies documenting the harm of "woo"? DanTex Dec 2013 #6

The ONE thing we know for sure is that there are tons of studies documenting the harm of poo* Berlum Dec 2013 #8

Yeah, materialism fuckin' sucks. Always has. nt AverageJoe90 Dec 2013 #43

I think the FDA should review claims and publish (maybe a website) what is known about okaawhatever Dec 2013 #9

Quack watch etherealtruth Dec 2013 #13

Well, ineffectiveness and harmfulness are different things. DanTex Dec 2013 #20

Really? etherealtruth Dec 2013 #21

All good points. DanTex Dec 2013 #22

Whereas iatrogenesis is a proven facet of the Poo Perplex in the realm of Scientific Materialism Berlum Dec 2013 #24

Anti-vaccine woo has convinced thousands of parents to not vaccinate their kids... SidDithers Dec 2013 #88

Yes, that another a good example. DanTex Dec 2013 #93

There is a site documenting this: Paulie Dec 2013 #12

Woo is not harmless etherealtruth Dec 2013 #15

Superstition and woo can definitely be deadly. stevenleser Dec 2013 #17

But not nearly as deadly as Poo* Berlum Dec 2013 #25

I am capable of dealing with two seperate issues etherealtruth Dec 2013 #27

In an obvious flame bait thread intended to dump on what is derided as 'woo' Berlum Dec 2013 #33

What the hell is "scientific materialism?" Archae Dec 2013 #36

I think this is part of Archea's campaign to get us to accept his ideas about the safety of Th1onein Dec 2013 #64

what are the first and second most fatal causes of death...? mike_c Dec 2013 #32

Even Iatrogenesis can be scientifically addressed. Woo can't. nt stevenleser Dec 2013 #74

Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2013 #19

Woo and alternative medicines are just as dangerous as prayer. Vashta Nerada Dec 2013 #29

Prayer is often used in conjunction with modern medical treatment. Kaleva Dec 2013 #47

Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2013 #30

Stupid op easttexaslefty Dec 2013 #37

Its not harmless, but i fear it is BootinUp Dec 2013 #41

But, but, but, What's the Harm? longship Dec 2013 #42

What's "woo"? Arkana Dec 2013 #46

"Woo" is a simplistic answer to an uproven hypothesis or theory when nothing else works. Uncle Joe Dec 2013 #49

Woo is the way people used to court one another. kwassa Dec 2013 #50

What is woo? PADemD Dec 2013 #53

Woo is wonderful, woo is whatever you want it to be. Egalitarian Thug Dec 2013 #69

"Woo" is a fake word used primarily as an insult by septics. kentauros Dec 2013 #73

Thanks Xyzse Dec 2013 #102

You're welcome! kentauros Dec 2013 #113

Faith in quackery. Orsino Dec 2013 #98

I don't mind much when adults kill themselves off with idiocy like this Warpy Dec 2013 #51

"Woo" doesn't have a particular definition. pnwmom Dec 2013 #57

Except this example was found out to be true by scientific study. Archae Dec 2013 #60

So you are 'claiming' that Poo finds Woo to be untrue Berlum Dec 2013 #75

Folic acid supplements to prevent birth defects were promoted in The Lancet. PADemD Dec 2013 #66

"Holistic" D23MIURG23 Dec 2013 #81

I don't have much faith in big drug companies quinnox Dec 2013 #86

DU rec... SidDithers Dec 2013 #87

I posted about the horrific case of Alex Spourdalakis some time ago... SidDithers Dec 2013 #89

Lack of critical thinking, yes. Woo, no. Archae Dec 2013 #90

They had been "treating" the autistic child with all kinds of woo... SidDithers Dec 2013 #91

Oh cripes... Archae Dec 2013 #94

As far as I can tell, they're still awaiting trial...nt SidDithers Dec 2013 #96

Steve Jobs tried to treat his cancer with woo KamaAina Dec 2013 #95

Edit - nevermind Xyzse Dec 2013 #101

RICK FLARE's WOO was the shitz! L0oniX Dec 2013 #103

I almost went deaf in one ear because of woo. Marr Dec 2013 #106

I keep forgetting is cannabis "woo" or not? When did it go off the "woo" list? riderinthestorm Dec 2013 #116