General Discussion

jimlup

(8,010 posts)

86. Yes - it isn't an "us" or "them" thing

Sun May 4, 2014, 06:29 PM

May 2014

Nor are any of these gender issues.

What the professionals who study this scientifically say is that it is about what is taught in school and how boys are currently relating to it. Girls are better at verbal processing and organizing. That is a fact of our brains. As a result - because much of what is done in school involves applied verbal reasoning - girls are out pacing boys.

I think this gap has been present for as long as we've been making the measurement but lately it has grown and I suspect some of this is due to raising standards in verbal reasoning (a worthwhile goal.) Anyway, I personally suspect that boys are being significantly hit by modern video games and other electronic distractions. While girls may text and log on to Facebook all the time, boys are playing mindless video games (and probably downloading porn.) One is more compatible with academic success than the other!

Anyway, if we could see working on the problem as helping our sons become better students rather than "sexism" in either direction then we are making progress.

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Fox News host: �Feminism is to blame� when boys do poorly in school [View all] YoungDemCA May 2014 OP

My mother was fairly Liberal for her day, but I remember when she told me she wasn't Tikki May 2014 #1

Her reasons may have been off, but it's better - far better- No Vested Interest May 2014 #25

She had no problem announcing each of my brothers' IQ results. She truly didn't want to upset them. Tikki May 2014 #27

I realize those instances do sting for girls, as happened No Vested Interest May 2014 #33

That is such utter bullshit on so many levels - and sadly many people believe it groundloop May 2014 #2

The very act of supporting women is discriminatory toward men. boston bean May 2014 #5

+1 Enthusiast May 2014 #77

this feminist has never allowed my two boys to make excuses for them choosing not to work. put in seabeyond May 2014 #3

What's his DU name? LeftyMom May 2014 #4

. boston bean May 2014 #6

omg... just coming off my post, totally disgusted, .... as a mom of two boys. seabeyond May 2014 #7

So if it quacks like a duck.... Major Nikon May 2014 #26

moooo. i am off to spend time with son. not gunna try to follow a duck seabeyond May 2014 #30

.....sigh....... alittlelark May 2014 #100

+++ Starry Messenger May 2014 #13

DU *names* CreekDog May 2014 #24

This message was self-deleted by its author name not needed May 2014 #29

I think we all want to know if we can liberally steal the phrase "lady-hating idiots." Squinch May 2014 #31

I would get a hide. You, too. Nt seabeyond May 2014 #34

From a posse of lady hating idiots, no doubt! Squinch May 2014 #35

Laughing my fuggin' ass off. Fuggin' is now a part of my autocorrect. Nt seabeyond May 2014 #37

So pointing out that schools are failing boys makes one a "lady-hating idiot"? Major Nikon May 2014 #38

When it's an argument being used in bad faith by people who hate women? LeftyMom May 2014 #41

So who is making that argument here? Major Nikon May 2014 #51

Are you trying to provoke me into a callout? LeftyMom May 2014 #52

Passive-aggressive is a better adjective. n/t lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #59

I'm pretty sure it was you calling other DUer's idiots unprovoked Major Nikon May 2014 #61

Well, check out this thread thucythucy May 2014 #72

Actually the arguments are 180 out from each other Major Nikon May 2014 #75

Not quite. thucythucy May 2014 #116

The first part is glaringly apparent Major Nikon May 2014 #122

Blaming it on feminism does. wickerwoman May 2014 #47

Good point Major Nikon May 2014 #50

See post 16. wickerwoman May 2014 #57

I didn't. Read better. n/t lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #60

I've already seen and replied to it Major Nikon May 2014 #65

excellent link. lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #49

" many regard this kind of favoritism a form of social justice" sufrommich May 2014 #62

not to mention, many of them are quite conservative Iris May 2014 #132

What about all the studies that show boys get more attention? knitter4democracy May 2014 #64

Of course they get more attention. lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #66

True, and that is something we have to work on. knitter4democracy May 2014 #73

...and get paid more for the REST OF THEIR LIVES. elehhhhna May 2014 #119

Wow. You speak for the cabal of "many" preschool teaching women? elehhhhna May 2014 #118

and they continue to..... bettyellen May 2014 #121

I wish we'd known this back when I was in school. Orrex May 2014 #8

Our schools also place more emphasis on boys in sports than they do girls. Could it be that boys jwirr May 2014 #9

There might even be a biological explanation for this gap: surrealAmerican May 2014 #10

point surreal. i will also suggest they are being hit hard with... boys are suppose to be proud of seabeyond May 2014 #12

parents... not school places the emphasis. seabeyond May 2014 #11

Holy Horseshit, Batman. Tuesday Afternoon May 2014 #14

I am man, hear me whine lame54 May 2014 #15

Education is failing boys and those feminists who don't care ARE part of the problem. n/t lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #16

parents.... are faililng our boys, allowing society to define them. nt seabeyond May 2014 #18

No. Parents work within an educational system in which 80% of teachers are women. lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #22

when did you sign your boys over to the school. cause i NEVER did. not only did i make that clear seabeyond May 2014 #23

so this would be a change over decades/centuries past how? teachers in the lower grades have TheFrenchRazor May 2014 #67

+1 nt laundry_queen May 2014 #68

How old are you? lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #70

Primary and secondary schools are designed to help sufrommich May 2014 #76

i'm 48, and yes, some things have changed, mostly due to the hysteria over school shootings; TheFrenchRazor May 2014 #108

No. YoungDemCA May 2014 #20

The author must be a MRA Major Nikon May 2014 #21

Why know, in fact, she's written stuff that the MRA's around geek tragedy May 2014 #125

I won't dispute that at all Major Nikon May 2014 #126

Pffft. What a bunch of evolutionary psychology nonsense. alp227 May 2014 #39

Then why are boys doing better in school than they have at any point in the past? Recursion May 2014 #105

Yours is the exact counterargument that the 1% use about wealth inequality. lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #112

Yes, I am exactly like the 1% Recursion May 2014 #114

Inequality is good? Then yes, you are. n/t lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #115

you misread the post or are intentionally making NO sense now elehhhhna May 2014 #120

Either... lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #127

you peons etc. is what YOU said. elehhhhna May 2014 #129

the teachers are not creating the modern education system Iris May 2014 #133

WAR ON WOMEN JaneyVee May 2014 #17

Tantaros and Kilmeade deserve each other. They are both horrid, horrid people. Comrade Grumpy May 2014 #19

So what is Kilmeade's excuse for being a wuss? SummerSnow May 2014 #28

Maybe boys know they don't need to work as hard because they'll make more money after Squinch May 2014 #32

good point. Iris May 2014 #134

One of those things that can't be discussed. Igel May 2014 #36

+1 n/t lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #46

Thank you. woolldog May 2014 #63

It gets really interesting if you dig a little deeper into the numbers Major Nikon May 2014 #69

These are the same people who hate affirmative action sufrommich May 2014 #40

This message was self-deleted by its author YoungDemCA May 2014 #93

The reasons can be debated, but the statistics is showing a problem with boys and education davidn3600 May 2014 #42

Why compare to women. Are more men getting more degrees than the past? Yes. That has nothing to do seabeyond May 2014 #44

The AEI appreciates your using their materials again. LeftyMom May 2014 #45

Are you serious right now??? davidn3600 May 2014 #54

Non-MRA, Non-AEI sources explain that very well. LeftyMom May 2014 #58

The fact you care so little about the other gender is a bit alarming... davidn3600 May 2014 #78

So your sources are the AEI and an "education consultant" who gets rich kids into rich kid colleges? LeftyMom May 2014 #79

How about several teachers and personal experience with the education system?? davidn3600 May 2014 #81

Well that's a convincing argument. LeftyMom May 2014 #83

Jury Results giftedgirl77 May 2014 #88

If the facts are not on your side, argue the principles. lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #90

Sometimes this place amazes me with the stupid giftedgirl77 May 2014 #91

what stupid shit? calling out right wing sources? that used to be the norm on DU Iris May 2014 #135

What right wing sources? giftedgirl77 May 2014 #137

ALERTER'S COMMENTS- These charts are materials generated by the AEI, a conservative right wing think Iris May 2014 #138

Jury results 2-5 to leave & told the alerter the alert was giftedgirl77 May 2014 #142

No, it's not. it's not ridiculous for people who have been here for a while, played by the rules, Iris May 2014 #143

Oh well, such as life. giftedgirl77 May 2014 #145

Not at all. Boys are much better off academically than a generation ago Recursion May 2014 #99

This is not success. lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #109

Third Way thinking strikes again.... Bluenorthwest May 2014 #43

They're wanting to move my 4th grade boy to 6th next year. ileus May 2014 #48

So much for "personal responsibility" Coventina May 2014 #53

My nephew has parents oldandhappy May 2014 #55

What a load of crap. City Lights May 2014 #56

Bwahahahaha ismnotwasm May 2014 #71

Back in the 1950s, there were a lot of hand wringing articles Warpy May 2014 #74

As a male HS teacher... jimlup May 2014 #80

Thank you ismnotwasm May 2014 #85

Yes - it isn't an "us" or "them" thing jimlup May 2014 #86

Message auto-removed Name removed May 2014 #82

Feminism isn't to blame for boys falling behind Harmony Blue May 2014 #84

Gosh, I hope the number of posters rushing to agree with Fox news gets the attention of DU's owners. Starry Messenger May 2014 #87

Wildly tortured logic on FOX? Say it ain't so! DirkGently May 2014 #89

Several thoughts dsc May 2014 #92

The die is cast long before they get to your grade level lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #95

Reading some of the responses here *almost* makes me regret posting this thread YoungDemCA May 2014 #94

all thru the school years of my boys, i watched excuses made for boys that did not do well. seabeyond May 2014 #96

Y'all are heavily invested in denying that the problem exists. lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #97

who brought up hitler but you. and ya.... i take this seriously. our boys. and our boys education seabeyond May 2014 #101

Acknowledging the problem and demanding attention to it isn't "hurting our boys" lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #111

I think you are wrong and have stated why I believe you are incorrect seabeyond May 2014 #113

further jeff, it is a good thing that i did not buy into this crap. selling my boys short. seeing seabeyond May 2014 #103

Again, it falls to feminism to take care of males BainsBane May 2014 #130

I don't feel that should be the case. lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #131

feminsts who care about equality should force boys to study, and men to go to doctors to use the bettyellen May 2014 #139

Feminists who don't care about the well being of boys and men shouldn't hide behind "equality". lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #144

They're interested in achieving equality for women, silly... bettyellen May 2014 #146

"equality for me" is an oxymoron. Equality for me *demands* equality for you. lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #147

Women work toward equal opportunities because they were denied them- bettyellen May 2014 #148

The hit dogs yelped. Starry Messenger May 2014 #107

Transparency is good, always good to see who aligns geek tragedy May 2014 #123

And yet, boys are doing better than they did "before feminism" Recursion May 2014 #98

of course they are. and that does not seem to matter. it is all about the fact girls, once given seabeyond May 2014 #102

Yeah, there was a chart here that was a huge red flag for me. Recursion May 2014 #104

Nice sig-line. Maybe I didn't notice it before. randome May 2014 #141

This thread is fascinating... Ohio Joe May 2014 #106

there are entire user groups here dedicated to agreeing with fox. nt geek tragedy May 2014 #124

it's not fascinating; it's disgusting Iris May 2014 #136

Very special personal responsibility from Fox News Tom Ripley May 2014 #110

This message was self-deleted by its author Glassunion May 2014 #117

If my gender made .70 for every dollar the other one did, I'd work harder in school too Hippo_Tron May 2014 #128

Fucking women! randome May 2014 #140