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In reply to the discussion: Hillary Is Like A Fish Out of Water When Talking About Class Issues [View all]F4lconF16
(3,747 posts)273. That's a good part of our problem, isn't it?
Last edited Wed Mar 25, 2015, 09:30 PM - Edit history (1)
Will vote Democrat without any fuss or hand-wringing.
We can't just vote without worry. We should be worried.
Voting by party instead of dearly held principle is a mindset that allows the elite to divide the working class into two groups and hold us to each other's throats. It's why we have massive financial fraud that remains unprosecuted; it's why we have a MIC that managed to lose 8.5 trillion dollars; it's why the real issues, like climate change, are rarely (if ever) discussed.
The problem is that by voting for party, you are saying that at some point you are willing to betray your principles. The elite realize this, and have set up these two groups in order to prevent any changes to the system. They then use the cover of "a greater evil" to justify their horrible policies under Democratic governance. It's why Obama has done very few meaningful things to address the MIC, etc.--he knows he doesn't have to, and he would lose substantial political support. They will keep shifting to the right as long as they can get away with it.
The Democratic party is reflective of the broken system we live in, and has been for over a hundred years now. Throughout history, it's been used as a bludgeon against the working class by giving just enough wealth to just enough people to prevent radical and lasting change.
Now, I'm probably going to be torn apart by establishment supporters for this post, so I might as well piss off the leftists here as well: FDR was a perfect example of how the elite managed to prevent a new system from being put into place. During the early 1900s, there was a (relatively) huge socialist/radical leftist movement, and widespread dissatisfaction with the system (to put it mildly). There was a real possibility that a radical leftwing party/group could gain power. The biggest danger to the establishment was that some of those groups had realized that racial and gender equality were necessary for a new system, should they have the chance to put it into place. This upset the balance of opposition between disadvantaged groups that the elite had carefully put into place over centuries.
In order to prevent the Socialist party from taking power, the Democratic party ran a left-wing establishment candidate who could garner support from a large chunk of the population and address some of their fears, concerns, and anger. FDR proceeded to put into place a system that is only recently being dismantled: a strong middle class. Note that after WWII we still had a huge poor class. The middle class was given just enough of the massive wealth the elite held in order to hold it's support for generations. In doing so, the Democratic party was able to prevent real change and people addressing the massive poverty and inequalities that have always existed in this country. I've read some authors that suggest that the MIC that we have now would not exist if not for the Democratic party's support. This is the genius of the capitalist system we live in: it produces such incredible wealth for a few that there is enough left over to mollify a portion of the population when necessary. These would be people who continue voting Democratic even when it is clear that some of these politicians do not support the working class. They haven't lost enough yet to look for something else.
And that, I think, is what voting for party over principle gets you: when you try to be "realistic" about change in the system, you will not change anything. You cannot work within a system that is actively trying to circumvent you; remember how that worked for Obama and the Republicans? Same for the working class and establishment Democrats: we will only affect real change when we accept that we have to stand by what is right.
Now, personally, I think the logical conclusion from that is some form of socialism, revolution, and a total abandonment of the capitalist society we have today. I won't advocate that here, for obvious reasons, but I think that it is something we should be thinking about.
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Hillary Is Like A Fish Out of Water When Talking About Class Issues [View all]
WillTwain
Mar 2015
OP
I don't think any of the politicians mentioned in this sad, tear-down thread are "all talk."
MADem
Mar 2015
#102
From Gallup an organization that has been dropped by many mainstream papers for
betterdemsonly
Mar 2015
#251
that just means 71% approved of him over his Republican opponent in a deep blue state
wyldwolf
Mar 2015
#57
He will, IF the Party Leadership provide the funds they are providing for the 'only candidate'
sabrina 1
Mar 2015
#140
What funds are the Party Leadership providing for the 'only candidate' ...
1StrongBlackMan
Mar 2015
#150
Agree, tired of corporate slick & the disappointers. The cry for humanity & passion that these
appalachiablue
Mar 2015
#277
That's about the extent of strong leaders today which is very slim given the times and for
appalachiablue
Mar 2015
#294
Nope and that's too bad, what a change in one generation. I've heard of
appalachiablue
Mar 2015
#291
There is a huge difference regarding 'talkers' between those who speak from the heart AND
sabrina 1
Mar 2015
#130
Great...can you name one Senator from the Right willing to address it at all...
Sheepshank
Mar 2015
#4
you've made several remarks that indicate you've been around longer than your post count indicates
wyldwolf
Mar 2015
#237
It always gets personal because personal attack is all these types of persons have. They
ND-Dem
Mar 2015
#285
Marx wrote about unequal wealth distribution in the nineteenth century.
DemocratSinceBirth
Mar 2015
#13
Carter was a fairly right leaning Democrat that is now painted as a liberal
TheKentuckian
Mar 2015
#131
Most people are guilty of a little sexism now and again- and discussing it is a good thing.
bettyellen
Mar 2015
#100
I hope Warren gets a lot more experience and runs- unless she is a hawk too.....
bettyellen
Mar 2015
#249
Apparently not, according to the latest "Libs don't like Hillary because they're misogynists" meme.
MannyGoldstein
Mar 2015
#253
Here's a much better example of a wonderful woman talking about class and wealth. OMG!
NYC_SKP
Mar 2015
#22
It was posted on DU recently that Hillary has over 200 fiscal advisers; yet, she has no solutions?
closeupready
Mar 2015
#37
If you're fine with a whiney president, I'm fine with you being fine with her.
closeupready
Mar 2015
#123
Maybe a little bird or maybe my son but I am not going to say at the moment.
leftofcool
Mar 2015
#80
With her all her experience, adaptation??? That shouldn't really be an issue
HereSince1628
Mar 2015
#170
Remember the story from years ago, where she did not know how to put gas in a car.
LiberalArkie
Mar 2015
#78
What 'discussion'? You just made a lame, fumbling attempt to paint someone as a Limbaugh fan. /nt
Marr
Mar 2015
#179
In the post directly above what you just responded to, you seemed to have all the answers.
wyldwolf
Mar 2015
#212
No thanks. I'll leave that kind of thing to 'progressives.' You're so good at it.
wyldwolf
Mar 2015
#136
I refuse to use the right wing smears against any Democrat whether I like them or not
leftofcool
Mar 2015
#154
The Bible says man is better to be alone in a desert than live with a contentious wife.
WillTwain
Mar 2015
#268
In 2008, I got behind him. By 2009, I knew better but by 2012 it was Obama or Romney/Ryan
WillTwain
Mar 2015
#213
Some politicians have the gift of seeming sincere, whether or not they actually are.
winter is coming
Mar 2015
#176
Can't stand Bill Clinton or much of what he did - but I have to agree he's a magnetic speaker.
closeupready
Mar 2015
#195
Now if I was interested in presenting a candidate I would show their strong points and talk about
Thinkingabout
Mar 2015
#181
Then I can post about his credibility and why Hillary is qualified and can win.
Thinkingabout
Mar 2015
#199
She is more at ease when it is bank executives she is speaking to. That is after all her crowd.
liberal_at_heart
Mar 2015
#205
FDR meant it and he was rich. For some reason he enjoyed humiliating the powerful.
WillTwain
Mar 2015
#258
Hillary is trying out her best Elizabeth impersonation, but it just comes across as forced, not genuine.
InAbLuEsTaTe
Mar 2015
#259