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In reply to the discussion: Looking at the undisputed facts in the Zimmerman case and applying Zimmerman's original story [View all]Spoonman
(1,761 posts)126. His original story......
First off, Zimmerman's statements made to police on the night of the incident have never been released.
So you are basing your entire argument on something you cannot verify.
What has been "released" was actually leaked by someone within the Sanford Police Department.
Was it complete, or an abbreviated version? Is it accurate?
No one say for certain.
Your statement from here and other posts:
1. "he was in essence blind-sided by Trayvon after having chased" position
2. "was that he was walking along and was surprised by Trayvon, and without any real verbal provocation"
3. "And in that version of events, there was barely any verbal exchange"
You are trying to impose some sense to your "logic" by dismissing the very "facts" you use to support it.
A verbal exchange most likely occurred (we have no proof as of yet to the content).
We can probably all agree on that.
However, the duration/word count really doesn't matter.
Physical altercations occure EVERY DAY starting with nothing more than a scowl and a loud "WTF?"!
That is the real world we live in, and that is the way I am looking at this situation.
You ask what exactly is the evidence that aligns what my gut feeling is?
Pretty simple, Z's injuries and T's injuries are both consistent with the story we have, the gun shot analysis is consistent with the story we have, and the statement from the only eyewitness that actually saw the altercation is consistent with the story we have.
In this case, there was someone who liked "to get in fights and has zero common sense", but most likely and judging on past history, that person wasn't Trayvon.
Perhaps Trayvon might fall into your category of "numerous 17 year olds" if we had heard of a long history of Trayvon getting into fights at school, having a criminal history of violence, etc.
Really?
You (along with the rest of the world) need to realize that the pictures paraded up and down main street of Trayvon are not an accurate reflection of the young man we are talking about.
Those "innocent pictures" were taken when he was roughly 10 years old, and his appearance, and demeanor had changed significantly.
How much past history do we really know?
His juvenile record has been sealed, and his parents will never paint him to be anything less than perfect.
I do know from the experience with my own son (now 21) you DO NOT get suspended for truancy or for being tardy unless you are already a problem student!
He was on suspension when he was shot in February, for possession of a 'marijuana pipe' and a baggie with drug residue.
He was suspended in October for graffiti, and after he was caught with a 'burglary tool' and a bag full of women's jewelry.
He was also suspended once for skipping school and tardiness.
There are numerous photos of him from his twitter account that show him tattooed up, and references to violent behaivior and drug dealing.
He had affiliations with people who demonstrated gang activity, and there is some evidence that he might have been dealing drugs on a small scale.
Sounds to me no different than mine and NUMEROUS other kids I know and have known.
Escalating behavioral issues are apparent.
I'm not blaming Trayvon for this, I'm simply pointing out some relevant facts.
Keep thinking a 17 year old just would not do something "like that".
SARASOTA, FL. A jury has found 17-year-old Shawn Tyson guilty of murdering two British tourists in Sarasota last year
http://www.mysuncoast.com/mostpopular/story/Shawn-Tyson-found-guilty-sentenced-to-life-for/lHz1RC6BZUOHxxHZ3IkD7w.cspx
My mind will be made up once I see conclusive proof either way, currently Z's story has very few holes.
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Looking at the undisputed facts in the Zimmerman case and applying Zimmerman's original story [View all]
Tommy_Carcetti
May 2012
OP
So what is Martin's motive in chosing to ambush Zimmerman instead of retreating to safety?
Tommy_Carcetti
May 2012
#49
Well, at least you realize in a very backwards way the racial component of this case.
Tommy_Carcetti
May 2012
#72
Zimmerman is the one with history of violent assaults against other people, Trayvon's offenses
JI7
May 2012
#89
Yeah, it makes so much more sense that a kid with Skittles and tea went looking for a fight.
EOTE
May 2012
#94
Each time there is a new Trayvon thread, a member of MIRT should be assigned to babysit it.
stevenleser
May 2012
#63
Re: #3, I don't see any mention in the transcript that resembles telling Z not to exit his vehicle
slackmaster
May 2012
#3
No, there are other ways to be in that location. Perhaps he hid and waited to see what
uppityperson
May 2012
#28
Zimmy doesn't have to defend from every crackpot theory? Hahahaha. thank you MIRT. eom
uppityperson
May 2012
#33
Your are incorrect regarding the Police Dispatch ...it was not a " suggestion"
FarPoint
May 2012
#26
It wasn't a lawful order. Zimmerman was under no legal obligation to follow the advice.
slackmaster
May 2012
#30
Prove to me that we all can disregard the direction of an officer as desired ...
FarPoint
May 2012
#104
Officers can give ORDERS to people only under very limited circumstances, such as emergencies,
slackmaster
May 2012
#110
Your reply is presumptuous nonsense. You imply that Zimmerman broke a LAW by not following advice,
slackmaster
May 2012
#112
There's a difference between feeling pugnacious and being downright idiotic.
Tommy_Carcetti
May 2012
#19
Suspended for pot vs a person with a long history of violence, are you fucking kidding me?
Quixote1818
May 2012
#34
How was Trayvon bigger than Zimmerman? You keep saying that, what do you base that on?
uppityperson
May 2012
#21
How would Zimmerman lose sight of him? And Martin was not bigger than Zimmerman.
Quixote1818
May 2012
#23
I would have to go beyond the undisputed facts for speculation as to the timeline.
Tommy_Carcetti
May 2012
#53
You're going beyond the undisputed facts and into areas of some dispute.
Tommy_Carcetti
May 2012
#51
All the physical evidence merely does is establish that a struggle took place.
Tommy_Carcetti
May 2012
#102
But would you agree that Trayvon deciding to ambush Zimmerman out of the blue doesn't seem logical?
Tommy_Carcetti
May 2012
#115
I think you are glossing over the fact that Trayvon was doing nothing wrong that evening.
Tommy_Carcetti
May 2012
#129
I don't know what happened, but a high school kid wanting to beat the crap out of some creep
Vattel
May 2012
#113
The defied logic comes in because of other circumstances you omitt in his situation.
vaberella
May 2012
#132