General Discussion

moriah

(8,312 posts)

113. What more was she supposed to do?

Wed Jun 1, 2016, 10:20 AM

Jun 2016

The deadbolts were higher than any child should have been able to reach, SHE had to use a stepstool to reach the highest chain only being 5'. Which sadly may have given the boys the idea to climb, but it was installed high as soon as they moved in.

It wasn't HER house, or her property, or her idea to put a trailer next to an unfenced pond they'd already been told was dangerous by neighbors and have toddlers living there.

My friend and her husband had been talking about getting alarms for the doors if they were opened the week before. Yet more guilt.

But if you're going to say she was "100% responsible" for their deaths, then while I'm sorry for your own loss, if I say another word this post will be hidden.

Edit:

Actually, I can say one more thing. You'd probably have said my grandfather would have been "100% responsible" too if one of the many times he, as the only adult too sjck to work, couldn't catch me when I figured out how to unlock the simple locks and get out and I had been hit by a car at 3, instead of thinking about the fact I'd been living previously in a trailer park and allowed to roam so teaching me that wasn't okay in the city was difficult, or that he wasn't working because he had emphysema and COULDN'T run.

And that makes me even more angry.

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PARENTS are responsible for the safety of their children. [View all] Coventina May 2016 OP

No one should ever be able to get into a zoo enclosure. bigwillq May 2016 #1

Oh please spare me. Coventina May 2016 #5

Both public places and parents should be held equally responsible bigwillq May 2016 #6

It is the parents' duty to ensure the child's safety. End of story. Coventina May 2016 #13

There will always be a way in bigwillq May 2016 #16

Please explain to me how this kid would have entered the exhibit with a parent watching? Coventina May 2016 #18

the outer world will never be bubble-wrapped for the convenience of parents. eos. magical thyme May 2016 #38

Mother? RoccoR5955 May 2016 #50

Mothers & fathers. It's my understanding that in this instance the father was not there. n/t Coventina May 2016 #68

Why wasn't he there with his kids? Dorian Gray Jun 2016 #120

Maybe he was working? Proud Liberal Dem Jun 2016 #129

I assume Dorian Gray Jun 2016 #130

Missed that Proud Liberal Dem Jun 2016 #131

plus 1000! rusty fender May 2016 #75

IKR? It seems like everyone else is supposed to take responsibility, because...."stuff happens" Coventina May 2016 #76

It was a FREAK accident Dorian Gray Jun 2016 #121

The woman ignored her kid when he said he was going to play with the gorillas. Coventina Jun 2016 #133

Right. Dorian Gray Jun 2016 #134

Thanks, I will continue to criticize inattentive parents. n/t Coventina Jun 2016 #135

Ha... Dorian Gray Jun 2016 #136

It's nice... sendero Jun 2016 #146

So the public is responsible when a parent leaves a child in the car? onecaliberal May 2016 #27

So if a child is kidnapped while at the zoo avebury May 2016 #49

No zoo enclosure should be easy for a determined 4 year old to penetrate. pnwmom May 2016 #32

To be fair, I think a determined four year-old... scscholar May 2016 #64

Easy??? Lol, yes it happened once in 30 years when a kid was not watched..... Logical May 2016 #79

This looks pretty easy. It's surprising it had never happened before. pnwmom May 2016 #80

THREE foot barrier!? prayin4rain May 2016 #90

And the source of the diagram was the director of the zoo. n/t pnwmom May 2016 #91

March 1988: Madison, WI Bettie May 2016 #36

And it occurs to me that if a four year old can get INTO an enclosure so easily, thucythucy May 2016 #82

There is that as well Bettie May 2016 #97

That is the purpose of the moat and the 15' drop. Ms. Toad May 2016 #99

Glad they keep up on it. thucythucy Jun 2016 #111

Also, I will add,... ret5hd May 2016 #2

Somehow, myself and my siblings managed to grow up in the dangerous 1970s Coventina May 2016 #3

Why so snarky to someone agreeing with you? ret5hd May 2016 #7

Sorry, wasn't trying to be snarky. Was agreeing. Coventina May 2016 #9

Good deal... ret5hd May 2016 #12

heh Dorian Gray Jun 2016 #122

Did you ever do anything that your parents didn't see? Ptah May 2016 #21

My parents were like two Cyberdine M101 security sentries Frank Cannon May 2016 #25

Hence, the very nature of seat belts simply coddles and enables bad parenting. LanternWaste May 2016 #23

What are you talking about? We had child car seats and seat belts growing up! Coventina May 2016 #24

In 1981 the CDC reported only 11% of people used seat belts, pnwmom May 2016 #33

Nobody is perfect, but they are still responsible. n/t Coventina May 2016 #69

And so are zoos. They are responsible for making sure their enclosures pnwmom May 2016 #71

If the gorilla escaped the enclosure, I'd agree with you. n/t Coventina May 2016 #72

If this was an adult who'd gotten into the enclosure, I'd agree with you. n/t pnwmom May 2016 #77

Back in the 50s my dad's family took a trip to DC LeftyMom May 2016 #35

My son was a handful PatSeg May 2016 #44

My kid sister and my son were hell on wheels too. LeftyMom May 2016 #56

Oh, I can totally relate to all this! PatSeg May 2016 #66

But if your son had told you he was "going swimming" BuelahWitch Jun 2016 #114

The mother had at least one other child with her. It's awfully hard to be 100% pnwmom May 2016 #78

And even when my daughter wasn't PatSeg May 2016 #86

The stories I heard about my husband and his brother . . . pnwmom May 2016 #87

Yeah PatSeg May 2016 #89

Me and my siblings grew up in the 1960s RoccoR5955 May 2016 #52

True. deathrind May 2016 #28

Comparative negligence metroins May 2016 #4

And such reasonable measures were taken, as demonstrated by DECADES of Coventina May 2016 #8

There's multiple parties at fault metroins May 2016 #11

As I posted down thread, yes, establishments have to have some safety measures. Coventina May 2016 #17

a reasonable prudent person could foresee that no one adult can control 4 small children magical thyme May 2016 #41

So what, she can never leave the house? moriah May 2016 #48

no. you arrange to go places with a spouse or relative or friend magical thyme May 2016 #93

Then I hope you're never a mom with four kids and a husband working.... moriah Jun 2016 #110

if you have 4 small children and can't afford a babysitter, then you can't afford to go to the zoo. magical thyme Jun 2016 #126

Right Dorian Gray Jun 2016 #124

the world is a dangerous place. parking lots are dangerous, busway and subway stops are dangerous magical thyme Jun 2016 #125

Listen Dorian Gray Jun 2016 #127

you're awesome! renate Jun 2016 #151

I totally agree with you. avebury May 2016 #58

she works for a daycare?!?!?!!!!! jeez, now there's a daycare I'd remove my child from in a magical thyme May 2016 #94

Yes the were her kids. avebury May 2016 #95

A reasonably prudent person would expect the mother to be watching her young so the little jtuck004 May 2016 #42

Nice to call a kid a "fuck trophy". moriah May 2016 #46

You certainly don't think much of that woman, do you? How pathetic. jtuck004 May 2016 #47

I think accidents happen and no one is perfect. And I hope you are never a parent... moriah May 2016 #53

Jury results merrily May 2016 #59

Fuck trophy??? Wow, what a disgusting term to call a child. nt Live and Learn May 2016 #65

You should probably consider therapy. n/t prayin4rain May 2016 #92

As opposed to people who feed children to gorillas via thier negligence, or people jtuck004 May 2016 #98

Oh, I get it now. A Colbert style Limbaugh parody. Cute! n/t prayin4rain May 2016 #104

ditto Dorian Gray Jun 2016 #128

I personally think "fuck trophy" is great! BuelahWitch Jun 2016 #116

This place WatchWhatISay Jun 2016 #144

Remember, the little boy repeatedly told his mother that he wanted No Vested Interest May 2016 #43

+1 narnian60 May 2016 #102

And that is the damning evidence right there BuelahWitch Jun 2016 #117

Yup, that would have been my cue to say, "let's go see the giraffes", winter is coming Jun 2016 #141

Good point. Distract the child by providing an alternative. nt No Vested Interest Jun 2016 #142

"if you can't handle such a responsibility, please, don't reproduce." unblock May 2016 #10

Agreed that there is a level of safety that has to be maintained. Coventina May 2016 #15

used to was parents were responsible oldandhappy May 2016 #14

K and r. cwydro May 2016 #19

I agree parents are ultimately responsible jehop61 May 2016 #20

Perception vs reality One_Life_To_Give May 2016 #22

I don't think that zoos are responsible for ADULTS who intend to harm themselves Nay May 2016 #30

I have a touch-look sister who did just that! sofa king May 2016 #26

All public beaches should also be closed. edgineered May 2016 #29

Parents do have the primary responsibility, but the society they live in should help karynnj May 2016 #31

My wife has "little kid in peril" radar Frank Cannon May 2016 #34

I have done this as well Bettie May 2016 #37

I once prevented a child from LibDemAlways May 2016 #57

That's from shock and embarrassment. Frank Cannon May 2016 #62

Exactly. If it was difficult for the mother to control four kids at the zoo, she shouldn't have valerief May 2016 #39

Some questions Arizona Roadrunner May 2016 #40

Okay, and when you have a child and fuck up for five minutes, accept your crucifixion. moriah May 2016 #45

If a child ever were to die / be seriously injured in my care, because I was "distracted" so be it. Coventina May 2016 #70

And has she been doing that? No. moriah May 2016 #73

I can't speak for this zoo in particular, as I've never been, but every zoo I have been to Coventina May 2016 #74

Yes. The thing that is sickening to me, though, is that no one seems to understand that... moriah May 2016 #83

People are crucifying the mother because an innocent, endangered creature was sacrificed due to her Coventina May 2016 #85

I, too, wish that neither primate had to die. moriah Jun 2016 #109

Very tragic story, and I'm so sorry for your friend's loss. Coventina Jun 2016 #112

What more was she supposed to do? moriah Jun 2016 #113

I didn't intend to anger you, but you did post the story, I assumed for my comment. Coventina Jun 2016 #115

I thought I made the circumstances pretty clear on those points in the first post. moriah Jun 2016 #118

Just because somebody was responsible doesn't mean they were ill-intentioned. Coventina Jun 2016 #132

I agree, but you can't say someone who shouldn't be... moriah Jun 2016 #137

Your point is well-taken. In that larger sense, we are all to blame. Coventina Jun 2016 #139

It wasn't four preschoolers... moriah Jun 2016 #143

People should stop referring the incident as an accident. avebury May 2016 #105

Unless you are there, have video, or have other... moriah Jun 2016 #108

she didn't fuck up for 5 minutes. she fucked up when she chose to take 4 kids to a busy, high magical thyme May 2016 #96

I watched an interview last night xloadiex May 2016 #51

That sounds like the type of kid who has no fear of anything avebury May 2016 #61

I can't tell you how many times I've watched parents crossing WHEN CRABS ROAR May 2016 #54

I saw that the other day. LibDemAlways May 2016 #63

I see so many parents allow their kids to climb everywhere liberal N proud May 2016 #55

There isn't a parent alive who LibDemAlways May 2016 #60

Blame serves to comfort us into thinking it would never happen to us. We're wrong. nolabear May 2016 #67

Oh my, PatSeg May 2016 #88

I feel ya, sister! I felt terrible about all those things, but nolabear Jun 2016 #149

Thanks for some sanity PatSeg Jun 2016 #153

Great post! and that is so true, raccoon Jun 2016 #147

Very true! PatSeg Jun 2016 #154

Wow... I've been lucky with my sons so far. Zing Zing Zingbah Jun 2016 #148

Little disasters you can roll with. We really were fine almost all the time. nolabear Jun 2016 #150

For any given problem there can be multiple points of responsibility. JonathanRackham May 2016 #81

I don't know the mother, so I'm not going to pass judgement ... salinsky May 2016 #84

Legally, you are incorrect. Ms. Toad May 2016 #100

There is strict liability when it comes to dangerous animals. Gomez163 May 2016 #101

Not for zoos. Ms. Toad May 2016 #106

Ok Gomez163 May 2016 #107

It seems like there's more anger at this mom than at the parents EllieBC May 2016 #103

It must be difficult Dorian Gray Jun 2016 #119

no shit... lame54 Jun 2016 #123

Hmmm...that sounds way too reasonable for DU, won't fly. Rex Jun 2016 #138

*sigh* You would think, after 14 years I would learn this. Coventina Jun 2016 #140

Parents... or whoever is the guardian at the moment.. Zing Zing Zingbah Jun 2016 #145

Absolutely agree. hamsterjill Jun 2016 #152