General Discussion

FighttheFuture

(1,313 posts)

49. I do not share your assessment, obviously. You give way to much credit to people as "rational

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 02:07 PM

Jun 2016

beings".

Given the degrading state of our educational system. the lack of opposing viewpoints, as were mandated under the fairness doctrine (thanks Ronnie Raygun), and the corporatism profit driven and ideological bent of almost all of our media today, real facts and honest discussion are hard to come by. Keep in mind many also do not have decent access to the internet, and many who do have no real idea where to go for information. To quell their confusion, they will usually gravitate to what feels right "in their gut". That is not rational, but it is human nature.

Also, you are confusing yourself.

We are rational beings. Or rather we are supposed to be. ... Mistrust of rationality leads to nothing but horrible ends.

I agree with this. You are positing a assertion, and what we should be, and the consequences of not doing it. I am not saying that, however. I am saying that people, in the absence of good facts, or the ability to analyse the facts they have, or have a grounded rational center to lash them to, will go for the gut. We are not as Rational as you think. That can be good, or bad... it really depends on the temperament and social conditioning of the person. I am not filled with hope on that for this country today!

As far as Fascism goes, maybe you can educate us all on "what it means." For myself, I am referring to the rise of corporatism, which Mussolini favored as the corporate groups interacting with the State. The other elements of the State in service to this, and the quelling of dissent and the rise of domination over all, the sick aspects of Nationalism, are not far behind. While we may not be exactly like Italy or Germany, is is more similar than not with these elements and the weakness of our "democracy". even Jimmy Carter calls it an Oligarchy not a Democracy, today.

Still, feel free to argue how many angels are on the head of a pin in your desire to support your disagreement.

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This comment perfectly explains why Brexit has left the UK's young feeling so devastated [View all] babylonsister Jun 2016 OP

My understanding is that if in the EU you could go work in any other country treestar Jun 2016 #1

I honestly don't know; hopefully someone babylonsister Jun 2016 #2

That will be part of the two year negotiation afetr Britain invokes Article 50. brooklynite Jun 2016 #4

I don't know about you, but I sure prefer to negotiate a trade agreement with auntpurl Jun 2016 #39

And this goes to the heart of many issues SoLeftIAmRight Jun 2016 #65

I have a relative who's a VP at a major international bank, in their London office... CaptainTruth Jun 2016 #20

Which is strange treestar Jun 2016 #23

It was bigotry, pure and simple. British right-wingers don't like brown people and they'll... ChisolmTrailDem Jun 2016 #25

That is exactly what this is about. liberal N proud Jun 2016 #27

They were confused and misled, as our voters are, by right wing propaganda reinforced by tblue37 Jun 2016 #53

Perhaps just their piece of the economy One_Life_To_Give Jun 2016 #63

lol SoLeftIAmRight Jun 2016 #73

While it's subject to negotiation, more than just those are affected. Igel Jun 2016 #21

My Asian Sister in law is in Great Britain Bluzmann57 Jun 2016 #40

Probably OK if she has become a citizen treestar Jun 2016 #52

What would leaving the EU SickOfTheOnePct Jun 2016 #75

I don't know Bluzmann57 Jun 2016 #79

That's easy SickOfTheOnePct Jun 2016 #80

Ok, for you folks who think the EU is all great, imagine it in the US fasttense Jun 2016 #57

They must have seen it as being to their benefit treestar Jun 2016 #61

You're confusing the Eurozone and the EU. UK kept the Pound the whole time. Recursion Jun 2016 #71

Yes, that's the entire point of the EU Recursion Jun 2016 #70

This - DURHAM D Jun 2016 #3

Yes, indeed! mountain grammy Jun 2016 #11

The prevailing culture Mopar151 Jun 2016 #16

Or as common sense. Marcuse Jun 2016 #62

Brings tears to my eyes: Surya Gayatri Jun 2016 #5

A bit of an overreaction though FLPanhandle Jun 2016 #6

I live now and used to work in France. The free movement of people and goods will be Surya Gayatri Jun 2016 #8

My (american citizen) niece lives and works in Germany philosslayer Jun 2016 #83

It is VERY difficult to arrive alone, on your own volition, and to find a job legally. Surya Gayatri Jun 2016 #84

It is very hard angrychair Jun 2016 #18

... Crepuscular Jun 2016 #41

Agreed. Lots of Chicken Little posts on here about Brexit hueymahl Jun 2016 #74

No, those concerns are perfectly justified. After yesterday's emergency Surya Gayatri Jun 2016 #85

... Crepuscular Jun 2016 #87

Prevailing anti-UK sentiment will lead the EU to make the divorce as costly and onerous as possible. Surya Gayatri Jun 2016 #88

... Crepuscular Jun 2016 #90

Today's hard line pronouncements coming from Germany's powerful Minister of Foreign Affairs, Surya Gayatri Jun 2016 #91

Rick's Cafe Americain has 2 exit visas, ... aggiesal Jun 2016 #46

Your points are all absolutely correct. All Continental contacts are about to get Surya Gayatri Jun 2016 #86

It'll be a lot harder treestar Jun 2016 #19

It's hard for some of us. davidthegnome Jun 2016 #32

I'm thinking with two years to unravel EU ties the UK, with the negative effect on their . . . brush Jun 2016 #9

Exactly...they have once again lived up to their historical nickname of "Perfidious Albion". Surya Gayatri Jun 2016 #10

"People are sick of experts" frazzled Jun 2016 #7

indeed... Fast Walker 52 Jun 2016 #13

Yeah, that jumped out at me too.. mountain grammy Jun 2016 #14

It is the arrogance of "experts." Indydem Jun 2016 #15

It is "getting fixed" because scientists spoke out and action was taken. Fla Dem Jun 2016 #28

You mean the same "experts" who gave us 2008? brentspeak Jun 2016 #26

+1!!!! KPN Jun 2016 #45

Exactly. We could spend all damn day on "experts" Bernanke and Greenspan alone. SMC22307 Jun 2016 #78

Ask yourself, why do people reject the advice of experts? FighttheFuture Jun 2016 #30

I do not agree with you at all. frazzled Jun 2016 #37

This message was self-deleted by its author FighttheFuture Jun 2016 #48

I do not share your assessment, obviously. You give way to much credit to people as "rational FighttheFuture Jun 2016 #49

This message was self-deleted by its author cyberpj Jun 2016 #44

+1. The problem with experts is that you need to have a solid, wide ranging foundation tblue37 Jun 2016 #55

Because people are resentful of people smarter than they are (nt) Recursion Jun 2016 #72

So you must be pi$$ed off all the time. n/t brentspeak Jun 2016 #81

And this is why we get people trusting crackpots rather that doctors in health matters. Odin2005 Jun 2016 #50

The problem, though, is that it's the experts... ljm2002 Jun 2016 #77

same old shit, conservative parochialism and BS wins again Fast Walker 52 Jun 2016 #12

"post-factual democracy"... OMG, that's us! procon Jun 2016 #17

I find one juxtoposition intriguing... malthaussen Jun 2016 #22

Actions have consequences ... eppur_se_muova Jun 2016 #24

Very unfortunate Cosmocat Jun 2016 #43

very pronounced treestar Jun 2016 #54

"Let's make Great Britain great again !" eppur_se_muova Jun 2016 #69

This is all BS..... roomtomove Jun 2016 #29

Wrong. It was about immigration and bigotted ignorant people against multiculturalism Bernardo de La Paz Jun 2016 #33

It's Jingoism lunatica Jun 2016 #42

I stand by my comment.... roomtomove Jun 2016 #56

Did those young voters actually bother to show up and vote? KittyWampus Jun 2016 #31

Well... davidthegnome Jun 2016 #34

makes me want to cry. niyad Jun 2016 #35

Our parents insist on leaving the world the way they left it.... Spitfire of ATJ Jun 2016 #36

'But can anybody tell me the last time a prevailing culture of anti-intellectualism elleng Jun 2016 #38

Key phrase in the quote from the young Brit: KPN Jun 2016 #47

British Boomers better pray their infuriated kids don't leave them to die on an ice floe. Odin2005 Jun 2016 #51

There will still be ice floes? n/t Hestia Jun 2016 #58

Oh, good point... Odin2005 Jun 2016 #59

America in a nutshell awoke_in_2003 Jun 2016 #60

Have the children really lost a sense of who they are? One_Life_To_Give Jun 2016 #64

I thought the "consensus" was fuck the kids they are ignorant, free stuff hungry slackers who will TheKentuckian Jun 2016 #66

The age demographic breakdown seemed to very closely mirror that of the Democratic primary. drokhole Jun 2016 #67

I see many similarities. .. unfortunately. libdem4life Jun 2016 #68

Don't get it. Travel has not been restricted Kilgore Jun 2016 #76

The EU is not a visa regime; that doesn't change Recursion Jun 2016 #82

Unfortunately the young voters didn't come out kiva Jun 2016 #89