General Discussion

Straw Man

(6,943 posts)

26. We must be watching different videos.

Wed Jul 20, 2016, 02:53 AM

Jul 2016

The guy was wrestling for the cop's gun, but...

why the hell do they always empty their gun into the suspect? He wasn't moving after the first shot.

The second cop fired seven shots. That hasn't been "emptying their gun" since service revolvers disappeared in the '80s. Virtually all police sidearms now are semi-automatic pistols holding 15 to 17 rounds.

The suspect most certainly was "moving after the first shot." Watch again: he is still kicking at the second officer's head until the fourth shot, and is still thrashing on shots five and six. That's when he goes limp.

He had been threatening people with the fire extinguisher. When the first officer entered, the driver was still on the bus and still at risk.

I can fault the first officer somewhat for allowing him to grab her pistol: a two-handed "close ready" grip would have denied him that possibility. But in her defense, she was trying to get on the bus as quickly as possible.

Cops are trained to draw their guns when they are going after violent suspects who are endangering the public. That is exactly what was happening here.

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Police officer executes Hispanic man during struggle over gun [Graphic] [View all] WhisCo Jul 2016 OP

I only watched it once but it was chaos. JanMichael Jul 2016 #1

Awful...I can't bring myself to watch. sarae Jul 2016 #2

He attacked a police officer TeddyR Jul 2016 #3

Agreed. 840high Jul 2016 #24

richard poplawski shot the first cop he saw Fred Drum Jul 2016 #31

agreed ? Fred Drum Jul 2016 #32

as I see it she instigated the struggle. larkrake Jul 2016 #110

How? Straw Man Jul 2016 #117

Maybe they could not come in pointing guns at the crazy man. Take some time instead. uppityperson Jul 2016 #4

They were trying to protect the bus driver who was stuck inside with that nut. Joe the Revelator Jul 2016 #7

Maybe approach him without guns drawn, take some time instead uppityperson Jul 2016 #9

What about the bus driver? No use saving the driver????? yeoman6987 Jul 2016 #14

Don't try to put words in my mouth. Waving guns was dangerous for the bus driver too. uppityperson Jul 2016 #15

Ok. I wasn't trying to. Sorry. It may have been poorly written and executed. yeoman6987 Jul 2016 #17

Odd that you're only able to perceive two and only two possibilities. LanternWaste Jul 2016 #46

Come on, we saw the video. The bus driver was pretty big . . . brush Jul 2016 #51

Uh huh... TipTok Jul 2016 #78

he was not stuck, the person was not blocking him larkrake Jul 2016 #112

If there was ever a time for lethal force, that was probably it. Joe the Revelator Jul 2016 #5

I don't think I'd call this an execution Stinky The Clown Jul 2016 #6

He shouldn't have gone for her gun... Throd Jul 2016 #8

Why is it always they reach for their gun first? brush Jul 2016 #10

Thank you. I am glad someone else sees that too. uppityperson Jul 2016 #16

Yes, many of us, even on this progressive site, need to reassess how we view police actions. brush Jul 2016 #22

How did the cops know everyone else was off the bus? ohnoyoudidnt Jul 2016 #70

It's obvious after watching the video Abq_Sarah Jul 2016 #132

Executes? Just a nut who tried to steal the officer's gun. Oneironaut Jul 2016 #11

I think the officers could use a bit more training Travis_0004 Jul 2016 #12

the male cop had no choice larkrake Jul 2016 #114

The guy was wrestling for the cop's gun, but... AgingAmerican Jul 2016 #13

We must be watching different videos. Straw Man Jul 2016 #26

He 'only' fired seven rounds? AgingAmerican Jul 2016 #30

Yes. Straw Man Jul 2016 #33

One shot was not enough... TipTok Jul 2016 #79

IF a cop has to fire their service weapon, the intent is to kill. MohRokTah Jul 2016 #83

The supposed intent is to stop the suspect AgingAmerican Jul 2016 #84

LETHAL Force is called that for a reason. eom MohRokTah Jul 2016 #86

That is what it is called afterward AgingAmerican Jul 2016 #87

You are wrong. MohRokTah Jul 2016 #88

No, it's always called "lethal force" or "deadly force" ... Straw Man Jul 2016 #89

he had his hand on her gun. an accidental fire was a good possibility, the cop larkrake Jul 2016 #109

I heard about this from the man's niece Saturday caraher Jul 2016 #18

Dont grab a cops gun. Travis_0004 Jul 2016 #64

One shot is to the point of death. mwrguy Jul 2016 #65

It is "shoot to stop". n/t oneshooter Jul 2016 #68

it's all considered deadly foroce mwrguy Jul 2016 #69

Do not want to get shot? Do not grab a cop's gun. jmg257 Jul 2016 #19

Local report sarisataka Jul 2016 #20

That cop quite probably saved the lives of his partner and the driver. cigsandcoffee Jul 2016 #21

Whoa! Look at it from a different perspective. That guy didn't have to die. brush Jul 2016 #23

Let me get this straight. Straw Man Jul 2016 #28

What are they, dunces? They can't figure out how to surround a bus? That takes the cake brush Jul 2016 #34

The cake. Straw Man Jul 2016 #43

Ok, we get it. You're all for killing instead of trying to de-escalate. brush Jul 2016 #50

Seems like a clear personal attack you made, brush. Eleanors38 Jul 2016 #53

no he didnt larkrake Jul 2016 #122

Oh. I forgot. The topic is Gunz. All's well. Eleanors38 Jul 2016 #144

No. You're wrong. Straw Man Jul 2016 #56

With a hostage. annavictorious Jul 2016 #126

Here's a link for you uppityperson Jul 2016 #40

Thank you. Straw Man Jul 2016 #44

City buses have both doors on the same side. brush Jul 2016 #54

City buses also have emergency exits and many windows. Straw Man Jul 2016 #58

Come on, we saw the video. That driver was much bigger and was not . . . brush Jul 2016 #59

Doubling down on wrong? Straw Man Jul 2016 #62

I disagree. Situation could have been deescalated without a killing. brush Jul 2016 #66

After the gun was grabbed? No. Straw Man Jul 2016 #72

My whole point was the guns didn't even have to be out brush Jul 2016 #73

And again, you're wrong. Straw Man Jul 2016 #74

And I think you're wrong brush Jul 2016 #90

You're entitled to your opinion. Straw Man Jul 2016 #99

Maybe try asking the bus driver to get off, then question him as to . . . brush Jul 2016 #100

Then you should offer your services, without fee or charge, oneshooter Jul 2016 #104

Guess you didn't watch the video. There was no armed suspect. brush Jul 2016 #113

By law when he picked up the fire extinguisher and threatened the officer oneshooter Jul 2016 #115

What makes you think they could have done that ... Straw Man Jul 2016 #116

Did you watch the video? Who's talking about a conversation with the driver? brush Jul 2016 #125

You are. Straw Man Jul 2016 #133

Sorry, rushing onto that bus with her gun out was the dumbest thing . . . brush Jul 2016 #134

And what is the depth of experience from which you speak? Straw Man Jul 2016 #135

I'll ask you the same thing. What's the depth of yours? brush Jul 2016 #136

Is that an answer? Straw Man Jul 2016 #137

Ok, with all the killings of people of color that are now evident because of the proliferation . . . brush Jul 2016 #138

I asked you about experience. Straw Man Jul 2016 #139

And you have some friends who are cops brush Jul 2016 #140

And I've heard their personal experiences. Straw Man Jul 2016 #141

It's not anybody's job... let alone a bus driver... TipTok Jul 2016 #80

Coulda , Shoulda is b.s.. kacekwl Jul 2016 #96

Explain to me how two cops can "surround" a bus MyNameGoesHere Jul 2016 #142

hard to argue against this shooting Angel Martin Jul 2016 #25

A tragedy from every angle. PdxSean Jul 2016 #27

Watch again. Straw Man Jul 2016 #29

I watched it again. PdxSean Jul 2016 #48

OK. Straw Man Jul 2016 #49

Yep, the first cop hesitated when he lunged. MohRokTah Jul 2016 #85

I don't think that male police officer had much of a choice. avebury Jul 2016 #35

That's easy to Monday morning QB after the fact Lee-Lee Jul 2016 #36

Had she ordered the bus driver off of the bus avebury Jul 2016 #37

how would she know there were not others still on the bus - sure, some left DrDan Jul 2016 #47

Your Statement Jim Beard Jul 2016 #76

She should have noticed that the only avebury Jul 2016 #91

Many people on this board need to run through a course of oneshooter Jul 2016 #39

Agreed , I took one and was very enlightened. kacekwl Jul 2016 #97

There seems to be a vocal minority that believes oneshooter Jul 2016 #103

Execution? Hardly. Captain Stern Jul 2016 #38

Question: What do you think this man was going to do with the gun once he had it? grossproffit Jul 2016 #41

and if had got the gun? Demonaut Jul 2016 #42

"executes"???? really? DrDan Jul 2016 #45

I agree. annavictorious Jul 2016 #127

Using the term "executes" for this situation may well constitute libel. (nt) LongtimeAZDem Jul 2016 #52

Going for an officer's gun is likely lead to self-defense in extremis. It did. Eleanors38 Jul 2016 #55

No one was executed. You should edit the title of your post. Vattel Jul 2016 #57

This was a "good shoot" and not an execution. Calista241 Jul 2016 #60

you can't fault the cop for that one. n/t. okieinpain Jul 2016 #61

yeh, I do. she should have told the driver to get off, then she and her partner scope the situation larkrake Jul 2016 #111

Not knowing what an erratic, violent man was doing inside ... Straw Man Jul 2016 #118

violent? he didnt touch anyone until she drew on him larkrake Jul 2016 #121

I suppose he grabbed the fire extinguisher ... Straw Man Jul 2016 #123

No, he didnt use it, he was amped for sure larkrake Jul 2016 #124

True, lady cop did screw up. N/t. okieinpain Jul 2016 #119

Executes??!!! what an inappropriate description. nt clarice Jul 2016 #63

Bullshit inflammatory headline. tritsofme Jul 2016 #67

It's easy to say "negotiate" when you're not in the cop's position. romanic Jul 2016 #71

Welcome to DU KMOD Jul 2016 #75

The officer should have used kung fu just like in the movies. RandySF Jul 2016 #77

That's cultural appropriation. Dr. Strange Jul 2016 #120

Similar to Michael Brown and Trayvon Martin cases. nm mr_liberal Jul 2016 #81

Yes, except totally different in every way Orrex Jul 2016 #93

only similarity is someone is dead, he brought it on himself when he grabbed her gun Demonaut Jul 2016 #95

They all did mr_liberal Jul 2016 #98

Cops did the right thing. MohRokTah Jul 2016 #82

Not an execution. The first cop was too close to draw down on the bad guy with one hand. Skeeter Barnes Jul 2016 #92

Watch the light. geek_sabre Jul 2016 #94

she should not have pulled her gun right off the bat. Where are the tazers? larkrake Jul 2016 #101

How was she supposed to get close enough to him to taze? WillowTree Jul 2016 #106

Taser guns have a range of 15-25 ft. If she was close enough he could grab her pistol... GummyBearz Jul 2016 #107

on a bus, thats easy larkrake Jul 2016 #108

My son is NYPD annavictorious Jul 2016 #130

Looks like a justified shoot? "Execution" hardly describes this. Lil Missy Jul 2016 #102

There is one thing we must do is make or complaints credible. Jim Beard Jul 2016 #105

Lots of folks who here are making suggestions for de-escalation annavictorious Jul 2016 #128

If someone has a gun and you shoot you shoot to kill there are no doc03 Jul 2016 #129

This incident falls into the "reckless escalation" category. aikoaiko Jul 2016 #131

Shoot the hostage. Take him out of the equation. Orrex Jul 2016 #143