General Discussion

Shankapotomus

(4,840 posts)

206. A lot of assumptions are being made in this thread on both sides

Tue Aug 16, 2016, 03:06 PM

Aug 2016

When sometimes what's pushing people to behave is not necessarily their own will but cultural conventions.

Especially when it comes to relationships people can almost fall into a trance-like state where they just obey conventional programming. After all, if tradition says that your the one that is supposed to propose the pressure to have your proposal accepted might drive someone make the attempt at the moment the woman is most happy.

So maybe it wasn't entitlement that caused the BF to ask at that moment but the pressure of potentially being rejected.

Patriarchy messes up everybody, including men, and perhaps we all need to be more sensitive to that instead of jumping down someone's throat all the time.

Stealing someone's thunder is a human thing, not necessarily a male only behavior.

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3 women are being honored with medals -- and 1 man decides to make it about him. [View all] pnwmom Aug 2016 OP

Jeez. Iggo Aug 2016 #1

Oh, let those crazy kids have both. Much happiness to them. nolabear Aug 2016 #2

You don't think he stepped on the moments of the Gold and Bronze winners when he jumped pnwmom Aug 2016 #9

Oh, I hadn't thought of that. Perhaps so. But I wouldn't think it sexist. Thoughtless, perhaps. nolabear Aug 2016 #11

The stories that said an engagement ring is a bigger prize than an Olympic medal pnwmom Aug 2016 #13

Okay, but that's not the betrothed. I'm not denying sexism is rampant and ridiculous in these games nolabear Aug 2016 #33

Well apparently, the guy was "forcing his life choices" on others. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #34

Sorry, I don't see how this justifies outrage. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #3

Right. Because a woman whose just gotten a gold medal should OF COURSE pnwmom Aug 2016 #4

It happened after the end of the ceremony. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #6

He climbed up on the stage with the winners. He didn't belong there. He should have waited pnwmom Aug 2016 #8

Something tells me that the Gold Medalist is going to be just fine. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #10

And the Bronze winner? And all the women and girls who are being told in media reports pnwmom Aug 2016 #12

From the looks of it watching yesterday, the Bronze medalist looked thrilled to have won a medal. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #17

The Bronze medalist shouldn't have had to share attention with the guy who jumped on the stage pnwmom Aug 2016 #19

The guy was probably caught up in the moment. Sheesh. Give him a break. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #20

No, he planned it, obviously. No one carries a ring to a public event without knowing pnwmom Aug 2016 #22

Well, isn't he just an awful person for doing that? Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #26

He planned that she'd medal in the event? jberryhill Aug 2016 #60

He planned to give it to her after her event. And he knew there was a likelihood she'd pnwmom Aug 2016 #64

"Probably" is effective grease when moving weighted goalposts. LanternWaste Aug 2016 #23

That was a pukeworthy quote right there. alarimer Aug 2016 #97

Value judgment of human relationships. AtheistCrusader Aug 2016 #178

I agree. I'd rather have my husband than a medal. But an engagement ring isn't a PRIZE pnwmom Aug 2016 #181

Whatever you do, don't watch Batchelor/Batchlorette AtheistCrusader Aug 2016 #232

Don't get me started! pnwmom Aug 2016 #234

It was after the ceremony melman Aug 2016 #14

They were still on the stage in front of the cameras. And he wasn't one of the winners. What don't pnwmom Aug 2016 #16

You seem to have invested quite a lot in Butthurt, Inc stock today. Dreamer Tatum Aug 2016 #95

No, it wasn't. The ceremony was still happening. Squinch Aug 2016 #52

Wrong melman Aug 2016 #72

Photographs of the three women were still being taken when he showed up pnwmom Aug 2016 #99

So there he is up on the stage where the ceremony is still happening and the three winners Squinch Aug 2016 #172

The ceremony was done with. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #173

If it was done, they wouldn't be alone on the stage with only olympic officials when he came up. Squinch Aug 2016 #187

Have you been watching the Olympics? Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #191

It was the ceremony. He was not a winner, he did not belong where he was. Squinch Aug 2016 #196

The ceremony was done with. nt Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #205

Nope. Squinch Aug 2016 #211

Okay, so exactly when does the ceremony end? Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #214

That's not the ceremony melman Aug 2016 #238

I think you should get a plane ticket to Rio Stat! snooper2 Aug 2016 #137

Sorry, I don't see how this justifies outrage. AlbertCat Aug 2016 #75

What utter crap... PoutrageFatigue Aug 2016 #5

I would say that he shat all over the gold medalist's and bronze medalist's moment in the spotlight. pnwmom Aug 2016 #7

Ugh leftstreet Aug 2016 #24

Salon is the one who inserted "make an honest woman".... ProudToBeBlueInRhody Aug 2016 #28

The AP could have phrased their article better, but the entire Salon piece just comes off... Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #32

It's crappy. It is her moment for her accomplishment. And it was the moment Squinch Aug 2016 #40

Did you miss the part about him proposing AFTER THE MEDAL CEREMONY? PoutrageFatigue Aug 2016 #47

Did you miss the part that NO IT WASN'T? It was DURING the medal ceremony. Squinch Aug 2016 #49

Check the video. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #63

Yep. There he is up on the stage with the three women who won the event, Squinch Aug 2016 #160

One more "Trust me" and I'm going to think I'm talking to Donald Trump here. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #175

I thought the same when you said "trust me," which is why I lampooned it. And Squinch Aug 2016 #189

He was off to the side. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #192

He was on the stage where only the winners and the olympic offical were. He did not belong there. Squinch Aug 2016 #197

Talk about reading comprehension. pnwmom Aug 2016 #66

Here's the video. You can get back to me with an apology after you watch it PoutrageFatigue Aug 2016 #83

I've seen it. And the women were still standing up there together, having photos taken, pnwmom Aug 2016 #84

Wrong. Not even worth a quick grin. PoutrageFatigue Aug 2016 #87

No, they weren't. Captain Stern Aug 2016 #134

The women were off the podium but on the larger stage, standing together as a group, pnwmom Aug 2016 #135

So not during the ceremony then? PoutrageFatigue Aug 2016 #141

The reporters at the scene used the word "during." And the women were not walking toward pnwmom Aug 2016 #142

The byline to the photo you linked to in the OP said AFTER PoutrageFatigue Aug 2016 #143

It is coercive, not romantic. alarimer Aug 2016 #98

Don't you think that should be HER choice? FBaggins Aug 2016 #128

That's the whole point, and the question, isn't it? skepticscott Aug 2016 #147

How do you know that he didn't consider it? FBaggins Aug 2016 #155

If he had considered it honestly skepticscott Aug 2016 #163

Professing his love for the woman he wants to partner with for the rest of his life... PoutrageFatigue Aug 2016 #140

If he's asking her in that situation skepticscott Aug 2016 #148

And you know this how? PoutrageFatigue Aug 2016 #151

For better reasons skepticscott Aug 2016 #153

So, in other words you've got nothing. PoutrageFatigue Aug 2016 #156

i don't find it romantic at all when it's done in that way JI7 Aug 2016 #268

This too! Squinch Aug 2016 #159

An engagement ring is a bigger "prize" than a silver medal? Quantess Aug 2016 #15

Call me unromantic, but I'm not a fan of public marriage proposals davidn3600 Aug 2016 #18

Me, neither. pnwmom Aug 2016 #21

Hear, hear! smirkymonkey Aug 2016 #25

I can't stand them melman Aug 2016 #30

I'm not a fan either SickOfTheOnePct Aug 2016 #37

If a male Olympian gets engaged, how many people would think that a new ring is a bigger prize? pnwmom Aug 2016 #42

Zero. sarae Aug 2016 #74

I'm not an olympian GummyBearz Aug 2016 #92

That's not the issue. The point is that the media is acting like the proposal is a bigger deal pnwmom Aug 2016 #93

I will say a prayer that they are not scared for life from this happening GummyBearz Aug 2016 #100

So say your wife worked her whole life to achieve something, like say she got a degree Squinch Aug 2016 #162

So ridiculous GummyBearz Aug 2016 #267

Ask your wife now. I bet she has an opinion about this. Squinch Aug 2016 #272

After watching the clip she said GummyBearz Aug 2016 #278

I think those who are flaming here about bad feminists have created a hysteria that is only Squinch Aug 2016 #279

Especially if his fiance skipped up to the stage during his medal ceremony, got all the Squinch Aug 2016 #161

I think it's more romantic... liberalmuse Aug 2016 #55

I think it's really annoying that the AP called the proposal an "even bigger prize". sarae Aug 2016 #27

Did you see this? PeaceNikki Aug 2016 #29

LOL pnwmom Aug 2016 #35

!!! sarae Aug 2016 #73

To you maybe it's not a bigger prize SickOfTheOnePct Aug 2016 #39

A silver medal is worth about $300 FBaggins Aug 2016 #130

So this obsession with public proposals is not just a U.S. thing. tanyev Aug 2016 #31

I wonder if over-the-top destination weddings are only a U.S. thing. nt JustABozoOnThisBus Aug 2016 #36

What a stupid, self-righteous, mean-spirited article. Donald Ian Rankin Aug 2016 #38

And from your perspective, there's nothing wrong with the AP writer saying that getting a man pnwmom Aug 2016 #41

Too bad. MicaelS Aug 2016 #43

Yeah, right. That's what society has always told men. pnwmom Aug 2016 #44

How about the other two medalists? It was crappy. Squinch Aug 2016 #50

The other two medalists had already left the platform Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #54

Both the article in the OP and this other article say it was during the ceremony. pnwmom Aug 2016 #59

The video clearly shows the others walking away after they take the picture. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #65

Watch.The.Video. PoutrageFatigue Aug 2016 #88

I did. They were still taking pictures when he inserted himself into the group photo, pnwmom Aug 2016 #89

Nope. They'd already left the podium. PoutrageFatigue Aug 2016 #90

The three women were standing on the stage having their pictures taken together. pnwmom Aug 2016 #91

Nope. The video shows different. Squinch Aug 2016 #171

If you interrupt the moment of triumph that your life partner has worked toward Squinch Aug 2016 #164

Thank you. Again, for those who don't seem to get it, he interrupted her Nay Aug 2016 #239

The three women have won the title of best divers in the world. And what is everyone talking about? Squinch Aug 2016 #263

i find these type of public proposals a turn off and nothing romantic about it JI7 Aug 2016 #45

I agree with everything you have said. DawgHouse Aug 2016 #46

If she was the only one on the podium, it would have been ok... joeybee12 Aug 2016 #48

Exactly. And from her as well. Squinch Aug 2016 #51

It wasn't during the ceremony. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #53

Multiple reports say it was during the ceremony. Like this one: pnwmom Aug 2016 #58

Again, the video. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #67

The video clearly shows him walking up to the woman and interrupting her moment with the others. n/t pnwmom Aug 2016 #76

The video disproves the original claim melman Aug 2016 #78

No, it doesn't. The young woman were still on the stage, together, having photos taken pnwmom Aug 2016 #80

Yours is even better than the one I posted...but who are you going to believe? PoutrageFatigue Aug 2016 #86

I think it was incredibly sweet. librarylu Aug 2016 #133

That was my first thought. Kingofalldems Aug 2016 #56

What if a girlfriend ran up to a gold medal winner and told him she was pregnant? Ilsa Aug 2016 #57

LOL. Good question. n/t pnwmom Aug 2016 #68

so the bride to be and other winners were in on it and ok with it and you only blame the man lol nt msongs Aug 2016 #61

The bride to be wasn't in on it. And what were the other women supposed to say pnwmom Aug 2016 #69

They would say.... Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #70

So you're saying they didn't really meant it when they said it didn't bother them melman Aug 2016 #101

They were making polite statements, as people often do. n/t pnwmom Aug 2016 #102

You know better melman Aug 2016 #105

Women are taught to be polite and not reveal negative feelings in public. pnwmom Aug 2016 #106

Really? deathrind Aug 2016 #62

Yes. "Making it about you" is the ultimate in bad form. n/t lumberjack_jeff Aug 2016 #71

Is this one OK? AlbertCat Aug 2016 #77

Did it happen during a medal ceremony? Squinch Aug 2016 #165

Did this one happen during a medal ceremony? Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #174

Yes. Squinch Aug 2016 #188

The very idea that men should be allowed at the Olympics is problematic. AngryAmish Aug 2016 #79

I'm gonna K&R this OP. Raine1967 Aug 2016 #81

Its just a silver Travis_0004 Aug 2016 #82

Just a silver? In the Olympics? What about the gold and bronze winners who got their moment pnwmom Aug 2016 #85

They seem to be fine with it FBaggins Aug 2016 #131

Nice moment for the couple - tough shit if anyone doesn't like it nt Dreamer Tatum Aug 2016 #94

Plus a brazillion. opiate69 Aug 2016 #231

Please stop with the fucking public proposals. alarimer Aug 2016 #96

Maybe we could ask He Zi for her opinion before declaring the whole episode sexist. bluestateguy Aug 2016 #103

She's not the only one involved. There were the gold and bronze winners who had their celebration pnwmom Aug 2016 #104

Agree canetoad Aug 2016 #107

Seriously? This is what modern feminism is about now? The Straight Story Aug 2016 #108

Yea we women are always 'bitter' when we speak out.... BooScout Aug 2016 #110

Stating an opinion is SO bitter! And stating opinions makes for bad feminists. Just so you know. Squinch Aug 2016 #274

Don't bother me.... BooScout Aug 2016 #277

I'm not bitter. I just don't think this is the message society should be sending to our daughters -- pnwmom Aug 2016 #118

Have you ever heard an athlete saying winning the Super Bowl or World Series..... ProudToBeBlueInRhody Aug 2016 #244

Has a Super Bowl winner's girlfriend ever interrupted the ring ceremony Squinch Aug 2016 #273

Someone makes a comment and you extrapolate that it is what modern feminism is ALL about. Squinch Aug 2016 #167

You know what's sad and annoys the hell out of me? BooScout Aug 2016 #109

The women that were actually involved melman Aug 2016 #112

None of us know what they really felt. Most women would understand that women are trained to be pnwmom Aug 2016 #114

Exactly! BooScout Aug 2016 #117

Yeah, she'd be called a castrating bitch! nt Nay Aug 2016 #240

But you're absolutely willing to presume to speak for their real thoughts mythology Aug 2016 #253

You know this how? BooScout Aug 2016 #116

Because they said so melman Aug 2016 #120

A reporter asked and they acted like they were fine with it. "Acted" being the operative word. pnwmom Aug 2016 #121

Exactly. BooScout Aug 2016 #122

No what's really telling melman Aug 2016 #125

No shit. 'Don't listen to them, WE know what they really meant'... PoutrageFatigue Aug 2016 #144

Women make nice and men believe them. Because if too many women said what they really think pnwmom Aug 2016 #241

This happens all the time at the finish line of tough mudder or spartan race. AtheistCrusader Aug 2016 #111

Regardless of the genders, I don't think anyone should tag onto an event like this pnwmom Aug 2016 #113

So say after the next men's event, a woman goes up on the stage while the three Squinch Aug 2016 #169

Strawman. AtheistCrusader Aug 2016 #176

Not a strawman. It's the exact same scenario. Squinch Aug 2016 #190

Not even close. nt Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #194

Exactly the same. Squinch Aug 2016 #198

So Qin Kai walked up in the very middle of the picture taking... Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #201

Essentially, yes. Squinch Aug 2016 #210

Essentially? Exact same thing? Or..... Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #216

In reality, not at all. AtheistCrusader Aug 2016 #229

Again, does not match the video of the actual event. AtheistCrusader Aug 2016 #228

Chinese girls will be fine without being lectured by Western women on what to be offended by. redgreenandblue Aug 2016 #115

I'm not blaming the young woman -- she was surprised by it. It's the young man who pnwmom Aug 2016 #119

They are women. Nuff said. BooScout Aug 2016 #123

The OP was concerned about "what message this sends to girls". redgreenandblue Aug 2016 #124

Yea....they have a history of murdering female babies in China... BooScout Aug 2016 #126

Yes. The Chinese need a lesson in their own history by Americans. redgreenandblue Aug 2016 #127

You are focused on the one athlete but there were two others whose moment onstage, pnwmom Aug 2016 #139

It isn't ethnocentric. This is a fad in the US, also. And the AP that carried the story about pnwmom Aug 2016 #138

K and R Euphoria Aug 2016 #129

Maybe you should ask HER opinion before getting all outraged? Odin2005 Aug 2016 #132

She's not the only one involved. There were two other women, the gold and bronze winners, pnwmom Aug 2016 #136

Except they didn't. They'd received their medals, heard the anthems and left the podium. PoutrageFatigue Aug 2016 #145

They were still on the stage having group photos taken. pnwmom Aug 2016 #146

Watch.The.Video. PoutrageFatigue Aug 2016 #154

Wait - so he did NOT get into the middle of the ceremony to propose? It was over? jmg257 Aug 2016 #158

Apparently so... PoutrageFatigue Aug 2016 #168

The women were still on the stage, posing together for photos, when he interrupted. pnwmom Aug 2016 #200

Again: They were done with the photos. Take a look at the video. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #203

Ha - you should meet my wife - she must have missed that class. jmg257 Aug 2016 #227

LOL, yeah you know men are such assholes and all..... ProudToBeBlueInRhody Aug 2016 #248

You are revealing YOURSELF. I made no generalized comments about men. Just about the actions pnwmom Aug 2016 #249

"Women are trained to be polite and supportive" ProudToBeBlueInRhody Aug 2016 #254

No, you are the one drawing that implication, not me. n/t pnwmom Aug 2016 #257

OWNED Loki Liesmith Aug 2016 #183

I'm not big on attention-whoring public proposals in sports anyway Blue_Tires Aug 2016 #149

*sigh*. Now you're just trying to pee in our corn flakes Taitertots Aug 2016 #150

How sweet. All the best to them. (nt) bigwillq Aug 2016 #152

Ew. I haven't been following the Olympics very closely, but I did see a clip of this and catbyte Aug 2016 #157

He took her moment - and that of the other two medal winners kiva Aug 2016 #166

I have the same impression that you do -- pnwmom Aug 2016 #185

Seems like the opinions are either for or strongly against, and the division is along clear Squinch Aug 2016 #170

Thanks, I think you've nailed it. pnwmom Aug 2016 #186

The idea is very deeply ingrained that approval or affection from men or a man Squinch Aug 2016 #193

I'm a man and I make no apologies for my position. MicaelS Aug 2016 #258

Well, bully for you. Squinch Aug 2016 #261

Happened again!! Although slightly different circumstances... bullwinkle428 Aug 2016 #177

Well he's just subjugating her and corralling people into his lifestyle choices and blah blah blah. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #180

Completely different circumstances . He didn't jump on stage and get in the middle pnwmom Aug 2016 #195

Differences aside, that didn't happen in this instance, either. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #199

They were still getting their picture taken when he went on the stage and stood with them. pnwmom Aug 2016 #202

No. They weren't. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #204

No it doesn't. The photographers were still taking pictures of the women when he turned up, and the pnwmom Aug 2016 #208

He was to the side. He wasn't in the shot. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #212

Multiple shots were being taken by multiple cameras. This one doesn't show him. n/t pnwmom Aug 2016 #224

There was press all around the stage and they took pictures. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #233

The ceremony WAS still happening, but aside from that, what is EVERYONE talking about? Squinch Aug 2016 #213

Actually I watched the event on TV the night before and didn't know about the proposal until.... Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #218

The basic takeaway: Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #179

Was He Zi upset? Loki Liesmith Aug 2016 #182

She wasn't the only one. What about the gold and bronze medal winners whose moment onstage pnwmom Aug 2016 #184

The gold and bronze winners don't need to be infantilized Loki Liesmith Aug 2016 #207

I doubt if most Olympians agree their medal comes from "a corrupt international drug and pnwmom Aug 2016 #209

And I would anticipate that most non-sociopaths would like their loved ones to Squinch Aug 2016 #215

Well, they did seem devastated by it. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #217

Oh, look! Three medal winners on the stage! What is that photo about? Their great Squinch Aug 2016 #219

You do know that this was a press photo taken after the ceremony, right? Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #220

Yes, I know, but it was supposed to be a press photo about the winners, wasn't it? Squinch Aug 2016 #221

I'm sorry, did someone strip those women of their medals? Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #222

Someone eclipsed their moment in the sun with their own little scene. n/t pnwmom Aug 2016 #225

Again, that press photo about the three olympic winners - what was it about? Squinch Aug 2016 #226

They don't keep Olympic records as to who gets engaged at the games. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #230

Except in that moment when their accomplishment was celebrated, someone else Squinch Aug 2016 #260

A lot of assumptions are being made in this thread on both sides Shankapotomus Aug 2016 #206

This is exactly the sort of shit Egnever Aug 2016 #223

+1 Marr Aug 2016 #252

I'm sure those feminists are devastated by your opinion. Squinch Aug 2016 #262

Clearly not cause they keep doing stupid shit like this Egnever Aug 2016 #264

FTW... PoutrageFatigue Aug 2016 #270

Again, your opinion is everything. Squinch Aug 2016 #271

This is the sort of nonsense the lable "SJW" was used for before it was turned into a RW slur. Odin2005 Aug 2016 #269

The lable (sic) SJW was never used before it was a RW slur. It's a tell. Squinch Aug 2016 #275

I mean, halfway around the world some nine-year-old girl who was never allowed to go to school NuclearDem Aug 2016 #276

Yawn. closeupready Aug 2016 #235

It was a proposal like no other ever in history lunatica Aug 2016 #236

He's an Olympic diver. She's an Olympic diver. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #237

You do understand two other women were on that podium.... BooScout Aug 2016 #246

See Post 215. Not my words. Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2016 #247

Oh no, more patriarchal upstaging of women by men with a marriage proposal!!! ProudToBeBlueInRhody Aug 2016 #242

Not at all the same. The woman proposed-to wasn't approached onstage after getting a medal, pnwmom Aug 2016 #243

As I said.....ALL GOOD WINK WINK ProudToBeBlueInRhody Aug 2016 #245

Seriously, this is just sadly bitter. Marr Aug 2016 #250

So, women are dishonest before some male asks them to marry them? I never could understand appleannie1 Aug 2016 #251

You'll have to ask Salon's Mary Elizabeth Williams what she meant ProudToBeBlueInRhody Aug 2016 #255

Mark this date, because we agree on something! :-) REP Aug 2016 #256

A few days ago an NBC announcer threw out some sexist implication still_one Aug 2016 #259

Yeah but before that comment, the swimmer herself had credited her husband for her success davidn3600 Aug 2016 #265

You'd think people never watched the Olympics before melman Aug 2016 #266