General Discussion

Nevernose

(13,081 posts)

216. Ill tell you EXACTLY how we have to change

Thu Nov 9, 2017, 01:28 AM

Nov 2017

But not for a few more days. I’d like to bask in the vicarious victories for a while. We got the BLM protestor made famous by a picture of him confronting the police elected; we got a trans woman beating the guy who wrote his state’s anti-trans legislation; we got an openly socialist newcomer beating the GOP whip; we got a Liberian refugee elected Mayor in super conservative Montana; we got a centrist elected governor in one state and a Goldman Sachs banker elected in another.

We brought our very diverse A game and the polls reflected that. Warm glows all around.

But we clearly still have to change. You know what they call a political party that doesn’t change? Conservatives. But that, thanks to thousands of people’s blood, sweat, and tears, is thankfully a conversation for a later date.

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So Tell Me, FUCKING AGAIN, How The Democratic Party Has To Change. [View all] VermontKevin Nov 2017 OP

Last night was a great victory! Chasstev365 Nov 2017 #1

"A better deal" is a fine message. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #5

"Ain't getting it?" KPN Nov 2017 #107

Here's how onit2day Nov 2017 #218

This is a cut and paste of a politician's fundraising email. lapucelle Nov 2017 #229

+1,000,000 George II Nov 2017 #271

Are you embarrased to give the source of this cut and paste? ehrnst Nov 2017 #232

This is a fundraising email from an Independent. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #243

Correction... lapucelle Nov 2017 #250

Not the original source, but someone on scout.com (in their political forum) posted this: George II Nov 2017 #269

You got quote marks. Where is your citation source. Thank you irisblue Nov 2017 #272

I agree Gothmog Nov 2017 #122

What proposed changes are you so frightened of? Ken Burch Nov 2017 #172

I am afraid of nothing proposed by Democrats. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #173

The vast majority of people proposing change ARE Democrats. Ken Burch Nov 2017 #176

Again, I am afraid of nothing proposed by Democrats. Perhaps you can VermontKevin Nov 2017 #177

There's no reason to make a distinction between things proposed by currently registered Dems Ken Burch Nov 2017 #184

I'm not making any distinction. I listen to Democrats about the Democratic Party. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #186

What matters is good progressive ideas that align with what we are about. Ken Burch Nov 2017 #267

No... those who don't belong to the party have no say..sorry they just don't. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #239

It's time to stop entertaining certain agendas. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #247

Yes...the idea that the party can be remade in a super left way in a center left country at best is Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #248

"working together" doesn't mean "mainly nominating centrists" Ken Burch Nov 2017 #266

What specifically leads you to incorrectly infer that? LanternWaste Nov 2017 #260

Some people can't be helped. wildeyed Nov 2017 #188

Yeah, but considering most low info voters tavalon Nov 2017 #203

Back to FDR. nt tblue37 Nov 2017 #258

I onlu hope the reason dems won is not because they aren't republican onit2day Nov 2017 #217

A win is a win...but many in Virginia ran on local issues...and that is always a winning strategy Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #241

Look at this newly elected person: murielm99 Nov 2017 #142

do you think dems won yesterday w/o the far left? questionseverything Nov 2017 #276

I am pointing out that this newly elected man murielm99 Nov 2017 #279

your answering things i didnt ask questionseverything Nov 2017 #280

All we have to do is GOTV and stick to the values of our former selves. mamas Nov 2017 #157

No one is arguing against that particular point... LanternWaste Nov 2017 #259

All the people w "constructive criticism" have disappeared for s bit. Seems they can't revel in our bettyellen Nov 2017 #2

Or maybe those with constructive criticism have been repeatedly told not to criticize? Ukapau Nov 2017 #70

It gets old doesn't it? KPN Nov 2017 #109

You reading my mind? Yup. Nothing to see. Ukapau Nov 2017 #154

That never stopped them before we won. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #117

Not interested MFM008 Nov 2017 #129

Well those anticipating losses and wanting to lecture others about them- what value was there in bettyellen Nov 2017 #163

A weak will would certainly obey the dictates of a suggestion LanternWaste Nov 2017 #261

I've criticized before, but I love this! Especially the Virginia delegate results! Lucky Luciano Nov 2017 #78

I agree. And yet I come here this morning and the first thing I read is KPN Nov 2017 #111

Oh please, we are all progressives....tired of that dance...how about a link to show us what Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #118

You'll certainly supply evidence to support your allegation, yes? LanternWaste Nov 2017 #262

Oh, so this OP is isn't constructive criticism. KPN Nov 2017 #108

Again...we are all progressives...aren't you happy about winning it is a big fucking deal you know. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #119

Yes, I am very happy. KPN Nov 2017 #133

How does this say fuck the progressives? It says no need to waste time on restructuring the Party... Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #151

Some people take EVERYTHING personally NastyRiffraff Nov 2017 #164

They feel irrelevant if they can't threaten to take their ball and go home ... Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #236

We never gain votes by being less-progressive on any issue. Ken Burch Nov 2017 #185

Indeed. Allowing gun manufacturers immunity from lawsuits has won our Party VermontKevin Nov 2017 #189

I don't defend that. Ken Burch Nov 2017 #191

No asked you to defend it. Why do you think you must? VermontKevin Nov 2017 #195

Yes- We need to besupporting a woman's right to control her body bettyellen Nov 2017 #192

And you know that I support that, so what is your point? Ken Burch Nov 2017 #194

We're talking about the party being "progressive" enough- and they have been squalking bettyellen Nov 2017 #196

That was maybe two or three people and that that was immediately put in check. Ken Burch Nov 2017 #197

Yes we do...in red states moderate Dems win by not being super liberal...and that is a fact. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #237

I was never an advocate of primarying Manchin. And I don't live in West Virginia. Ken Burch Nov 2017 #268

That is correct...all politics are local...you can run a variety of Democrats depending on the seat. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #273

Fine. But that doesn't have to mean we also can't have big ideas Ken Burch Nov 2017 #274

Yeah it kind of does...don't nationalize elections with the divide we have now. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #275

progressive is a generic word like pro-life delisen Nov 2017 #222

Virginia Democrats turned out and carried the day yesterday. nt LexVegas Nov 2017 #3

Yes! peggysue2 Nov 2017 #134

K&R! betsuni Nov 2017 #4

Mostly agree greeny2323 Nov 2017 #6

Who, precisely, is too old? VermontKevin Nov 2017 #10

I want the new and the old. I want all of them. "Old" got experience which new does not. All hands Madam45for2923 Nov 2017 #15

Thank you! tonyt53 Nov 2017 #53

Important point! pandr32 Nov 2017 #75

Hear, hear!! n/t sagesnow Nov 2017 #81

THIS sheshe2 Nov 2017 #112

Exactamundo! oasis Nov 2017 #138

This! A million BlueMTexpat Nov 2017 #225

+1 uponit7771 Nov 2017 #238

Stilted language is EXACTLY the problem. lagomorph777 Nov 2017 #39

Let me get this straight. So we have to do something different than last night to win? brush Nov 2017 #65

We are smart enough to make continuous improvements. That's how wars are won. lagomorph777 Nov 2017 #66

So speaking fast and using run on sentences... IthinkThereforeIAM Nov 2017 #85

OK smartypants. lagomorph777 Nov 2017 #86

Perhaps... IthinkThereforeIAM Nov 2017 #99

There's nothing in lagomorph777's sentences that shows any dislike of such skills. CaliforniaPeggy Nov 2017 #124

You may read it at your own reading speed, lagomorph777 Nov 2017 #127

Lol! cwydro Nov 2017 #159

My job is done... IthinkThereforeIAM Nov 2017 #190

Ah, no, you don't understand what "stilted speech" is muriel_volestrangler Nov 2017 #231

That is what I implied... IthinkThereforeIAM Nov 2017 #235

No, I don't think you understand public speaking muriel_volestrangler Nov 2017 #246

Going by the definition provided... IthinkThereforeIAM Nov 2017 #265

Someone reading badly from a teleprompter is "stilted" muriel_volestrangler Nov 2017 #270

Strategy is how wars are won...and running moderates ( in moderate states) Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #152

Confusing, isn't it? NastyRiffraff Nov 2017 #245

Many people will cheer the desire for commercial branding LanternWaste Nov 2017 #264

Party leadership is too old is bullshit. That is just an excuse. LiberalFighter Nov 2017 #43

No Trump appeal in VA and why would we emulate that loser. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #121

Simple BeyondGeography Nov 2017 #7

Who, precisely, is not clearly different from the Republicans? VermontKevin Nov 2017 #12

Anyone who says that the 2 parties are the same is lying & has an agenda. Madam45for2923 Nov 2017 #17

Damn fucking straight. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #18

Anyone who does not see the difference is either gaslighting or covering their eyes. SO WHATEVER. Madam45for2923 Nov 2017 #20

Apparently there are millions of people, literally, who disagree with you and KPN Nov 2017 #128

?????? Anyone who does not see the difference is either gaslighting or covering their eyes. Madam45for2923 Nov 2017 #145

How do you know that? Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #153

This makes no sense. Bernie lost every truly liberal stronghold. Except R B Garr Nov 2017 #207

I guess that's why we win all the time then BeyondGeography Nov 2017 #26

She did. Can't blame her for those who don't listen. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #30

We're in no position to gloat BeyondGeography Nov 2017 #37

I disagree with that to an extent. whopis01 Nov 2017 #100

She did have a clear message pandr32 Nov 2017 #80

Both parties of the same has been wore out. NCTraveler Nov 2017 #47

And Barack Obama isn't giving meaningless speeches BeyondGeography Nov 2017 #49

Complete deflection. NCTraveler Nov 2017 #52

meaningless speeches ? stonecutter357 Nov 2017 #57

Yeah, heres what a meaningless speech sounds like BeyondGeography Nov 2017 #63

Transparent. NCTraveler Nov 2017 #71

Who is responsible for the politics of division again? BeyondGeography Nov 2017 #83

I absolutely agree with you, Beyondgeo! Why the heck keep it quiet about who the villains are? Ukapau Nov 2017 #87

Lots and lots of people and groups. NCTraveler Nov 2017 #94

Gingrich weaponized political language in the 90's and told fellow Republicans to never refer to Ukapau Nov 2017 #82

Well said BeyondGeography Nov 2017 #84

THIS KPN Nov 2017 #149

Great post! True Blue American Nov 2017 #223

Doesn't sound meaningless to me radical noodle Nov 2017 #160

This message was self-deleted by its author True Blue American Nov 2017 #224

I admire your willingness to engage along this line KPN Nov 2017 #136

Thank you, KPN BeyondGeography Nov 2017 #150

This is hilarious. You appreciate that someone can't accept reality that R B Garr Nov 2017 #208

Exactly. KPN Nov 2017 #148

+1 KPN Nov 2017 #115

I disagree...2010 was all about supposed progressives abandoning Pres. Obama for not getting Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #126

Looks like we learned our lesson treestar Nov 2017 #8

Totally agree. Blue_true Nov 2017 #93

+1 but don't want to hear it again .... lunasun Nov 2017 #9

We lost the white vote and STILL won. That should tell us something about ehrnst Nov 2017 #11

No need to appease or convince those who will not see their own noses. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #14

A year after Donald!! For a racist Gillespie. So charming. Madam45for2923 Nov 2017 #21

White college educated came out for the democratic party yesterday Fresh_Start Nov 2017 #60

And they watch FOX and listen to right-wing radio -- we need a larger progressive presence in the Ukapau Nov 2017 #90

Post removed Post removed Nov 2017 #141

No Democratic presidential candidate has won the white vote since LBJ, so... Garrett78 Nov 2017 #139

It's nothing but "bothsiderism": The GOP sucks, that's why the Democrats suck. DetlefK Nov 2017 #13

Tell us again, how we must divide ourselves and be conquered. L. Coyote Nov 2017 #16

So funny DFA calling Northam "racist" & not endorsing but Black Women payed them no attention. Madam45for2923 Nov 2017 #23

+1 uponit7771 Nov 2017 #31

The Virginia race was a classic case of Republicans bringing out the Dem voters. L. Coyote Nov 2017 #41

LOL Gothmog Nov 2017 #125

MSM/GOP & naysayers trying to take the narrative from us DEMS! We are "Reclaiming our time" Madam45for2923 Nov 2017 #19

Reclaiming My Time!!! VermontKevin Nov 2017 #22

LOVE THIS SO MUCH!! Thank you for posting this!! NurseJackie Nov 2017 #24

Love this, BlueMTexpat Nov 2017 #226

Thank you! mcar Nov 2017 #25

IMO, we need to introduce UBI and define it for over 40 and no job. CK_John Nov 2017 #27

If it's only for over 40 and no job Codeine Nov 2017 #33

UBI is a process that has to be defined, age 40 is my personal solution. CK_John Nov 2017 #46

I'm not arguing against UBI at all. Codeine Nov 2017 #59

Pls start by defining what UBI stands for for those of us who don't know. brush Nov 2017 #68

Universal Basic Income radical noodle Nov 2017 #161

The minute we run on UBI GulfCoast66 Nov 2017 #72

But how do you ensure that all have Dark n Stormy Knight Nov 2017 #205

kick and rec! JustAnotherGen Nov 2017 #28

K&R Progressive dog Nov 2017 #29

It was that damn establishment Democrat LBJ who pushed for the civil rights and voting rights act. still_one Nov 2017 #32

But they Party is changing! Look at the diversity among those elected last night. airmid Nov 2017 #34

Diverse racially and ethnically and diverse politically. Blue_true Nov 2017 #95

Yup. And that's a good thing. KPN Nov 2017 #144

Wait a few days Progressive dog Nov 2017 #35

You'd better believe it. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #36

Not *all* of them. (If you know what I mean...) NurseJackie Nov 2017 #38

It already has changed DBoon Nov 2017 #40

The organizing effort to make last night happen began months ago with Wwcd Nov 2017 #98

This message was self-deleted by its author WinkyDink Nov 2017 #42

The only change needed is better GOTV efforts. MineralMan Nov 2017 #44

Agreed rpannier Nov 2017 #220

Sure it has to change. LiberalFighter Nov 2017 #45

I'm not convinced that a huge anti-Trump surge means we now own the road. I'm a liberal brewens Nov 2017 #48

The Dem Party needs to study what happened, so it can try to repeat it. We need to WIN. Honeycombe8 Nov 2017 #54

"The Dem Party needs to study what happened"??? Wwcd Nov 2017 #69

agreed Locrian Nov 2017 #167

Let's not be so divisive just yet. Can't we enjoy the huge victory w/o bickering? Honeycombe8 Nov 2017 #50

Thank you so much for that! KPN Nov 2017 #147

We must not do what is left, right, or centrist... DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2017 #51

Thank you! Thekaspervote Nov 2017 #55

Kick, kick, kick & Rec! UtahLib Nov 2017 #56

All we need to do is GET OUT THE VOTE The Mouth Nov 2017 #58

That's the real world of politics in a nutshell. L. Coyote Nov 2017 #76

Two hours of driving people to the polls on Election day The Mouth Nov 2017 #135

It's about grass roots organizing bucolic_frolic Nov 2017 #61

When we vote we win world wide wally Nov 2017 #62

This post pretty much answers itself Cosmocat Nov 2017 #64

Exactly this. Kentonio Nov 2017 #77

This. shanny Nov 2017 #88

We have 85 yards to go... Duncan Grant Nov 2017 #155

Cap locked profanity? Let me clutch some FUCKING PEARLS! VermontKevin Nov 2017 #244

Oh goodie, I know how to push your buttons. Duncan Grant Nov 2017 #251

Yes. Me laughing at your objection to profanity is obvious evidence that you have VermontKevin Nov 2017 #254

Poor anonymous irrelevant internet message board poster... Duncan Grant Nov 2017 #255

...that you spend time answering. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #256

Fish meet barrel. That was too easy. Duncan Grant Nov 2017 #257

Exactly. Owl Nov 2017 #230

Im happier than anyone angrychair Nov 2017 #67

The Democratic Party has to change ... Dr Rise Nov 2017 #73

I am also just as happy or happier than everyone here! denvine Nov 2017 #74

Great wins last night hueymahl Nov 2017 #79

We definitely had a very good night last night. awesomerwb1 Nov 2017 #89

The party is changing and its working. aikoaiko Nov 2017 #91

Perez is doing an awesome rebuilding job. Blue_true Nov 2017 #92

You're asking for it IronLionZion Nov 2017 #96

I think it would be a mistake. Snackshack Nov 2017 #97

Too late. It's already been mistaken by some it appears. KPN Nov 2017 #104

Phil Murphy ran as JustAnotherGen Nov 2017 #227

Really? This is how you celebrate a good night for the Democratic Party? KPN Nov 2017 #101

+1 HopeAgain Nov 2017 #106

Sorry that you define "progressive" as being against what I stated in the OP. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #123

You know what you're doing melman Nov 2017 #131

Tell us all what you think I am doing. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #137

Why would I bother to do that melman Nov 2017 #170

We competed in all of the down ticket races. That is the main change. mjvpi Nov 2017 #102

All we have to do is vote. If we all voted, we'd never lose. Iggo Nov 2017 #103

AMEN! samnsara Nov 2017 #105

K&R ismnotwasm Nov 2017 #110

The Democratic Party needs to continue growing, evolving, and adapting to win. klook Nov 2017 #113

yup- tell me again that the democratic party doesn't have a message LVNVblue Nov 2017 #114

Thank you Kevin...they are at it but have been shown to be completely wrong. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #116

From Tom Perez Gothmog Nov 2017 #120

We were united against Trump. And that is a very good thing Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #130

Thank you for serving democracy MaryMagdaline Nov 2017 #132

It seems you are spoiling for a fight tavalon Nov 2017 #140

Tell me how bad a candidate Hillary is after getting 3.5 million more votes. librechik Nov 2017 #143

The Democratic Party needs to figure out what just happened and how, and do more of it. Orsino Nov 2017 #146

GOTV is key. We have the numbers. We have the message. We need to DO. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #174

My State, Washington, apparently had 22% voter turn out tavalon Nov 2017 #193

Sounds as though hardline conservatives weren't feeling it. Orsino Nov 2017 #249

I have been comfortable where Dems are all along the way. A lot of noise to disrupt and divide, SandyZ Nov 2017 #156

It's not actually tavalon Nov 2017 #198

The Democratic Party has never supported Citizen's United and have worked to eliminate it. SandyZ Nov 2017 #199

Only the liberals of the party. Hope that clears up your confusion tavalon Nov 2017 #202

If you know Democratic Leaders are against Citizen's United, then I see no reason for discussion. SandyZ Nov 2017 #206

With their words tavalon Nov 2017 #212

Clinton pledges constitutional amendment to overturn Citizens United ruling SandyZ Nov 2017 #215

K&R!! Thank You!! So sick of the constant undermining R B Garr Nov 2017 #158

Fox host melts down as DNC chairman Perez gloats over Tuesday's big election wins Gothmog Nov 2017 #162

Backlash voting is not sustainable. Otherwise you ping pong between failures. egbertowillies Nov 2017 #165

Kindly point to the non-Progressive Democratic winners last night. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #175

Thank you for this post. The Wielding Truth Nov 2017 #209

Instead of the top of the ticket pulling votes to the polls The Polack MSgt Nov 2017 #166

Thank you!! brer cat Nov 2017 #168

this kind of gloating is ridiculous. You know this was a referrendum on Trump and the GOP right? JCanete Nov 2017 #169

Last night was a big win. Thanks for your personal efforts. Ken Burch Nov 2017 #171

let's be real Skittles Nov 2017 #178

Disgust doesn't get people to the polls. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #180

OH YES IT ABSOLUTELY DOES Skittles Nov 2017 #181

No. Hope gets people to the polls. Hope that things will change. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #187

... Skittles Nov 2017 #213

What made her get off her barstool and to the polls? VermontKevin Nov 2017 #240

The hell it doesn't. Disgust with all things tRump* is the number one issue... Raster Nov 2017 #253

With this edition of the GOP/Trumpy, Eyeball_Kid Nov 2017 #179

In a fair fight, we win Generic Other Nov 2017 #182

Say it, brother. George II Nov 2017 #183

This paragraph from Rude Pundit said it best. robertpaulsen Nov 2017 #200

Okay tavalon Nov 2017 #201

I am the liberal wing. The base. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #204

I can't come to your meetings tavalon Nov 2017 #211

The Only One . . . DarthDem Nov 2017 #221

Instead of arguing for voter registration drives, do one. A table, forms, and some posterboard is VermontKevin Nov 2017 #242

I'm a 12 hour nightshifter so I've been trying to drum up support, rather than doing it myself tavalon Nov 2017 #281

... LexVegas Nov 2017 #210

Well -- do you think Tom Perez is improving things? I sure do! Yeah, Tom! Ukapau Nov 2017 #214

Ill tell you EXACTLY how we have to change Nevernose Nov 2017 #216

It was a great night and hoping the remaining in 5 HoD in Va tilt our way rpannier Nov 2017 #219

Is this a trap? If I answer the question you posed joet67 Nov 2017 #228

We must change and evolve.. Magoo48 Nov 2017 #233

A great deal of the Democratic win was a rejection of not only Trump, but the Dustlawyer Nov 2017 #234

Kevin saidsimplesimon Nov 2017 #252

Evolution works much better than revolution. LanternWaste Nov 2017 #263

Post removed Post removed Nov 2017 #277

Well, here IMHO... Orange Free State Nov 2017 #278