Latest Breaking News

MADem

(135,425 posts)

69. We don't know if that happened and it had no effect.

Sun Jul 28, 2013, 02:23 PM

Jul 2013

The ambulance crew might not have wanted to get near a guy with a big shiny knife, and I can't say I blame them, particularly. Would you wade in with a hypodermic in that situation?

We don't have enough detail to "condemn" anyone here--not the staff (who apparently were competent enough to know the procedures for involuntary commitment, which aren't all that simple), not the ambulance crew, who were unable to calm this guy down by whatever means they used, and not the police, who would have been justified shooting the guy.

What we don't know exceeds what we know. There's no doubt it is a tragic situation, but it's not like the cops just ambled up and machine gunned this guy for shits and giggles. They went out of their way to keep their guns holstered, even though the guy had a knife.

I don't like excessive force when it comes to police, but I don't see it here. They were the third line of defense in this scenario.

Cannot edit, recommend, or reply in locked discussions

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

199 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

This message was self-deleted by its author [View all] Th1onein Jul 2013 OP

Those are not cops... those are pigs. Plain and simple. A cop would have been reasonable. n/t nebenaube Jul 2013 #1

We've got to find a better analogy... truth2power Jul 2013 #45

Well said. JimboBillyBubbaBob Jul 2013 #161

They are Fascist Criminals warrant46 Jul 2013 #175

My old pastor exboyfil Jul 2013 #2

And a lot of cops Lugal Zaggesi Jul 2013 #4

Yay cops! Cops are great! Th1onein Jul 2013 #10

Ah, bullshit. cliffordu Jul 2013 #13

??? heaven05 Jul 2013 #41

You would think a 95 year old in great shape Jamastiene Jul 2013 #151

Alzheimers or other form of dementia exboyfil Jul 2013 #152

glad you're visiting your grandmother regularly, kudos wordpix Jul 2013 #168

All cops seem to be lunatics these days blackspade Jul 2013 #3

Yeah, the cop in Vegas that died trying to rescue a lost hiker dbackjon Jul 2013 #98

Cue the milk carting cop, someone, QUICK! Th1onein Jul 2013 #101

Post removed Post removed Jul 2013 #104

You obviously missed the point of my post.... blackspade Jul 2013 #146

Know how many Vegas cops have been murdered Nevernose Jul 2013 #163

Being in an adjoining suburb I can tell you many of these cops... orbitalman Jul 2013 #5

Why did they have to "do" anything? He wasn't holding hostages, right? nolabear Jul 2013 #6

We can expect that they'll make up some story that they thought that he would hurt himself. AnotherMcIntosh Jul 2013 #51

Well, killing him certainly solved that problem. nolabear Jul 2013 #71

I Work RobinA Jul 2013 #93

cops out here undergroundpanther Jul 2013 #136

Fucking fucking fucking fucking PIGS. kath Jul 2013 #7

this is a case we hear about olddots Jul 2013 #8

I know. It's frightening. Th1onein Jul 2013 #9

New police motto: "To Protect And Serve Ourselves" burnodo Jul 2013 #11

Police are not required to protect citizens atreides1 Jul 2013 #32

How Would A 95 Year Old Man In A Nursing Home DallasNE Jul 2013 #12

Yeah but he had a shoe horn. avaistheone1 Jul 2013 #15

If seems to be one of those after-the-fact knives. A drop knife. It is inconsistent with the AnotherMcIntosh Jul 2013 #52

A 12 inch drop knife? A butcher knife? From a guy who lived in an apartment at an elderly MADem Jul 2013 #75

Post removed Post removed Jul 2013 #77

Terrorists are everywhere. n/t L0oniX Jul 2013 #55

+1000?????? Tom Ripley Jul 2013 #172

Hard to believe howicit Aug 2013 #185

There is no 95 year old man alive that I wouldn't defacto7 Jul 2013 #14

There are a tiny handful of martial arts masters in their 90s, but this was not one of those cases. Kennah Jul 2013 #18

Yeah, and they could be pretty good at it defacto7 Jul 2013 #22

My native Japanese Kendo Master is 72 years old and can mop the floor with anyone in our Dojo Katashi_itto Jul 2013 #34

Oh I'm sure. defacto7 Jul 2013 #65

??? Katashi_itto Jul 2013 #70

Whoa! question mark is right! defacto7 Jul 2013 #86

Oh ok, I was totally at a loss what you were talking about Katashi_itto Jul 2013 #87

Well then, I wouldn't find any usefulness in Kendo myself. defacto7 Jul 2013 #88

heheh :) Katashi_itto Jul 2013 #90

pretty amazing! defacto7 Jul 2013 #103

Its one of the fastest martial arts. Katashi_itto Jul 2013 #121

My 9 year old son does kendo. Bonobo Aug 2013 #186

Good lord 8th Dan? Is he in Japan or outside? Katashi_itto Aug 2013 #190

We live in Japan nt Bonobo Aug 2013 #191

Nice! Katashi_itto Aug 2013 #192

I think you're safe Kennah Jul 2013 #145

And he's TWENTY THREE YEARS younger than this man was. Th1onein Jul 2013 #120

Verne Gagne, the former wrestling champion.... ProudToBeBlueInRhody Jul 2013 #154

The staff at his assisted living facility had called an ambulance to involuntarily commit him. MADem Jul 2013 #25

It doesn't appear there was much training, because if their was, I would think it would of involved midnight Jul 2013 #37

We don't know if that happened and it had no effect. MADem Jul 2013 #69

Our population is aging and needs qualified people who won't ramp up a situation into this midnight Jul 2013 #137

so heaven05 Jul 2013 #42

So...you're saying it was okay to let a crazy, violent man run around an elderly apartment MADem Jul 2013 #72

Maybe, maybe not. defacto7 Jul 2013 #67

I don't think they took the decision to make that 911 call lightly. MADem Jul 2013 #73

I can't say it enough; I fuckin' hate cops. n/t vaberella Jul 2013 #16

Please let your local PD know that you won't ever need their assistance dbackjon Jul 2013 #100

Will do! Considering I live in Harlem and I'm Black. It's pretty much a given. n/t vaberella Jul 2013 #162

Nothing has changed. The U.S. has always been this way. What a sad situation. :( tofuandbeer Jul 2013 #17

It's almost as though people in authority positions can sense the end is near, and they're scared. Kennah Jul 2013 #19

Hope these poor cops aren't so traumatized they need an 8 month paid vacation & permanent disability NBachers Jul 2013 #20

how absolutely tragic. n/t orleans Jul 2013 #21

Killing War Heroes who called accidentally hit 911, Shooting wheel chair guys armed with pencil laserhaas Jul 2013 #23

He was mentally ill; being 'involuntarily committed.' MADem Jul 2013 #24

And your point is what? blackspade Jul 2013 #35

My point is what I posted. Since you're acting like you know more than anyone here, how's about MADem Jul 2013 #68

Come on, now. tom_kelly Jul 2013 #74

And the ambulance crew couldn't subdue him. MADem Jul 2013 #76

For Starters RobinA Jul 2013 #94

My brother used to do that work, and it is certainly difficult. He sometimes came home MADem Jul 2013 #113

I could Have RobinA Jul 2013 #134

Angry MADem is Angry. blackspade Jul 2013 #99

Well, that's just not a helpful subject line, and as for "uninformed posts" MADem Jul 2013 #107

LOL! blackspade Jul 2013 #147

so heaven05 Jul 2013 #43

If the police wanted to "kill him!!!!" a bullet would have been more efficient. MADem Jul 2013 #64

beautiful on "out their way". So a 95 year old ran everyones patience out, heaven05 Jul 2013 #66

And you "know" this, how? That he ran "their" patience out? MADem Jul 2013 #80

like heaven05 Jul 2013 #82

I think the one doing the rationalizing here isn't me. MADem Jul 2013 #84

Okay heaven05 Jul 2013 #85

Well, that was quite the rant. Your kindness and compassion are noted! MADem Jul 2013 #110

Could be owing to "Toxic Masculinity" SleeplessinSoCal Jul 2013 #26

I'm going to have to disagree with this, if those cops weren't such Nancy boys, Snake Plissken Jul 2013 #30

They were being "dicks", which is part of the description of "toxic masculinity". SleeplessinSoCal Jul 2013 #83

Do we know that the police were male? nt MADem Jul 2013 #114

If you're debating the premise that many boys are raised to be dickish, SleeplessinSoCal Jul 2013 #122

No. I'm not debating "dickish," I'm responding to "Toxic Masculinity." MADem Jul 2013 #125

Possibly you're not aware of this documentary that at it's heart is "toxic masculinity" SleeplessinSoCal Jul 2013 #142

I was aware of it, thanks to your link in your previous post. MADem Jul 2013 #143

You are welcome. And thank you for . . . . SleeplessinSoCal Jul 2013 #148

I had one just like that for almost 22 years. MADem Jul 2013 #149

I think I'd rather be stabbed by a 95 year old man trying to disarm him, than use a taser on him Snake Plissken Jul 2013 #27

That's what I was thinking. snort Jul 2013 #48

Seriously what is the point of all that fancy SWAT armor police forces get? /nt Ash_F Jul 2013 #92

Well Obviuosly they don't trust it very much warrant46 Jul 2013 #176

Okay, cue the badge sniffers telling us it's only a select few bad apples Nanjing to Seoul Jul 2013 #28

This is a big thing to me. napoleon_in_rags Jul 2013 #29

that is the answer bcbink Jul 2013 #31

#1. as said upthread, this is assisted living NOT A NURSING HOME. #2. I know someone who does KittyWampus Jul 2013 #36

police heaven05 Jul 2013 #44

Police hatred - fUCKING DISGUSTING dbackjon Jul 2013 #102

evidently heaven05 Jul 2013 #108

Post removed Post removed Jul 2013 #111

right heaven05 Jul 2013 #115

And your anecdote is about a hospital not an assisted living facility. blackspade Jul 2013 #49

+1000 heaven05 Jul 2013 #50

Speaking as someone trying their best to cope with caring cstanleytech Jul 2013 #60

He dropped those, and picked up the knife, per the reports. MADem Jul 2013 #119

Ah, that clears it up a bit then. Thanks. cstanleytech Jul 2013 #124

+1000, my mom with Alzheimer's used to think people were out to do her/me in wordpix Jul 2013 #61

You have my sympathy and a cstanleytech Jul 2013 #91

thanks so much wordpix Jul 2013 #167

Thank You RobinA Jul 2013 #95

You don't have the story straight, I'm afraid. MADem Jul 2013 #116

Lethal force was indeed used against this poor man. DLevine Jul 2013 #132

I know they were doing an autopsy to determine cause of death. MADem Jul 2013 #138

Sorry, just saw your reply this a.m. DLevine Jul 2013 #156

So No waving, just shooting. blackspade Jul 2013 #150

Why didn't they just sit down and wait him out? Peace Patriot Jul 2013 #62

Why didn't the ambulance crew do that? They called the police, and they MADem Jul 2013 #118

you're the one who is "clueless" steely Jul 2013 #89

"people freaking out can't be gently restrained" so you agreed with the taser use that killed her? napoleon_in_rags Jul 2013 #127

They are going to come up with a story that they thought that he was a danger to himself. AnotherMcIntosh Jul 2013 #54

Yeah, this change in story happens often, it seems..... Th1onein Jul 2013 #123

The ambulance drivers thought he was a danger--that's why they called for the police. MADem Jul 2013 #144

How would you have gotten the knife away from that guy? MADem Jul 2013 #117

If I were on a police crew? napoleon_in_rags Jul 2013 #128

Aren't ambulance crews trained thusly? MADem Jul 2013 #130

No one said you had The Wizard Jul 2013 #33

They are not cops sorefeet Jul 2013 #38

there were many protocols that were violated during this confrontation madrchsod Jul 2013 #39

you're kidding heaven05 Jul 2013 #40

I worked in a nursing home.. earthbone Jul 2013 #46

You loaded a shotgun with Chocolate Chip Cookies? JustABozoOnThisBus Jul 2013 #47

Jerky response Bozo tom_kelly Jul 2013 #78

Look at this closely Lugal Zaggesi Jul 2013 #53

The size of the knife also magically transformed from one with a 7" blade to a 12' butcher knife. AnotherMcIntosh Jul 2013 #58

He was in his apartment. His apartment with a kitchen. MADem Jul 2013 #126

"The nursing home says Lugal Zaggesi Jul 2013 #133

I live next door to a couple in their nineties. MADem Jul 2013 #139

The man in the photo Lugal Zaggesi Jul 2013 #160

Good for your athelete. The woman I was talking about, who still works, MADem Jul 2013 #164

Your thinking is muddled Lugal Zaggesi Jul 2013 #169

Your anecdote is NOT evidence, and my thinking is not "muddled," thank you very much. MADem Jul 2013 #170

LOL Lugal Zaggesi Aug 2013 #179

I have no idea what you're LOLing about. MADem Aug 2013 #181

You need to read more closely Lugal Zaggesi Aug 2013 #187

No I don't. MADem Aug 2013 #193

If you want to understand what you're reading... Lugal Zaggesi Aug 2013 #195

No, I do not--and flashing pictures of right wing hate mongers is a helluva way for you to make your MADem Aug 2013 #196

He's an American that is quite content with being ignorant, gullible and confused. Lugal Zaggesi Aug 2013 #197

No. I'm done with you. Go hang out with your ignorant, confused and gullible friend if you'd like. MADem Aug 2013 #198

was staying out of this one, but i was involved in a temporary detention order for a 92 loli phabay Aug 2013 #184

True Lugal Zaggesi Aug 2013 #188

Cowards. What can be more cowardly than shooting a 95-year old with beanbags? AnotherMcIntosh Jul 2013 #56

The Long Ranger has better tactics. Lasso the dude to restrain him. L0oniX Jul 2013 #57

How did a cane and metal shoehorn suddenly change into a 12 inch butcher knife? cstanleytech Jul 2013 #59

Think they missed the episode from Longmire PatrynXX Jul 2013 #63

Study should be done on exactly how and who are being hired as cops these days. Bet ya can trace it glinda Jul 2013 #79

Agreed. It is a leadership problem. A leadership problem where they view the populace as the enemy AnotherMcIntosh Jul 2013 #81

I agree. It is top down and who/what they are connected to. glinda Jul 2013 #165

Sad to say many police officers UglyGreed Jul 2013 #96

But we're talking about two vastly different skill sets here. Brigid Aug 2013 #194

I totally agree UglyGreed Aug 2013 #199

I hope the police ignore any calls for help you make dbackjon Jul 2013 #97

Personally, I make it a rule NOT to call the killers. Th1onein Jul 2013 #105

Disgusting. Americans put their lives on the line daily to protect us all dbackjon Jul 2013 #106

HEY! I bet you got that picture of the milk carting cop, doncha? Th1onein Jul 2013 #109

Post removed Post removed Jul 2013 #112

Medical examiner report riverwalker Jul 2013 #129

I hope the cops are proud of their handiwork. DLevine Jul 2013 #131

That's totally surprising Lugal Zaggesi Jul 2013 #135

He probably could have been saved. MADem Jul 2013 #140

oh heaven05 Jul 2013 #158

You, again. Another invective-laden post directed at me. MADem Jul 2013 #171

okay heaven05 Jul 2013 #177

There are no words to describe how awful this is briankdinnj16 Jul 2013 #141

Didn't police tase a 5 year old a year or two ago too? Jamastiene Jul 2013 #153

Maybe. At a minimum, there was a 6-year old: AnotherMcIntosh Jul 2013 #155

This message was self-deleted by its author silvershadow Jul 2013 #157

Yes: 720 ILCS 5/ AnotherMcIntosh Jul 2013 #166

Here we go again with the anti-cop nonsense from the peanut gallery. RBInMaine Jul 2013 #159

FFS! I've got one thing to say to that: HE WAS NINETY FIVE YEARS OLD! Th1onein Aug 2013 #182

my take on this fwiw steve2470 Jul 2013 #173

"We'll get more information eventually." NO, WE WON'T. Th1onein Jul 2013 #174

Did the cops high five each other? Kingofalldems Jul 2013 #178

Lets say he WAS armed with a knife Nevernose Aug 2013 #180

another of those new, for profit not-a real 'nursing home" with no proper trained staff. Sunlei Aug 2013 #183

It's hell to be old in the USA... tXr Aug 2013 #189