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CTyankee

(68,240 posts)

76. I will be in eastern Tuscany in March on an art intensive study...

Thu Jan 30, 2014, 07:21 PM

Jan 2014

and I think the Italian government is wrong in its assessment here. Looks like she is going to be a pawn in the trade agreements talks between the U.S. and Italy.

But I will be in a little medieval town called Anghiari and going to other small towns around it where the artist Piero della Francesca painted many of his early Renaissance masterpieces. These little towns derive some good income out of the art lovers who seek to find the inspirational location of an artist of incomparable importance in Western art. One can do worse than to go to their towns, eat their cuisine, stay in their inns and discover their culture.

I do not wish to deny these towns their rightful claim to the beauty and genius of Piero and my (modest) dollars to support that with my visit. Until the Americans got wind of this in a big way, the Brits had trekked for years to Piero's historic landmarks. Now these towns have gained a real tourist advantage for those travelers who are art inclined to do this. I want to encourage their cooperation. I would NOT like to see them forced to give up their art treasures to pay for their existence.

Italy's art is its heart and soul and her gift to Western civilization. We Americans should respect that.

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Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito lose Meredith Kercher murder appeal [View all] alp227 Jan 2014 OP

I was supposed to attend a meeting in Italy this summer.... cab67 Jan 2014 #1

The Italians have made international fools out of themselves flamingdem Jan 2014 #4

This message was self-deleted by its author tenderfoot Jan 2014 #174

what a stupid reason Jeneral2885 Jan 2014 #8

Your response is offensive. cab67 Jan 2014 #23

No, it is not offensive... Demenace Jan 2014 #121

I'm still awaiting your apology. cab67 Jan 2014 #133

American courts wouldn't have convicted geologists for manslaughter for not predicting an earthquake pnwmom Jan 2014 #60

OMG Scairp Jan 2014 #74

No joke. They're appealing it now. n/t pnwmom Jan 2014 #80

it would help if the real reasons were disclosed WilmywoodNCparalegal Jan 2014 #172

That is a lie. There was NO information collected before the earthquake that would have led any pnwmom Jan 2014 #184

It's not a stupid reason Scairp Jan 2014 #71

I can't believe Americans keep sending their college students there. What loving parent pnwmom Jan 2014 #81

there are some great programs from terrific schools there for college kids. CTyankee Jan 2014 #109

My sister went to one of them -- in Perugia -- and so did my best friend. But neither of them pnwmom Jan 2014 #111

I'm not afraid. I'll be on my fifth trip to Italy in mid March. CTyankee Jan 2014 #113

My two college age nieces will not go to a Red State schools... Walk away Jan 2014 #132

Before this I would have done Scairp Jan 2014 #148

I thought that they actually found someone guilty question everything Jan 2014 #33

they did. they convicted a guy of raping and murdering her. geek tragedy Jan 2014 #35

This is really crazy question everything Jan 2014 #140

I will be boycotting everything Italian. I wish everyone would. pnwmom Jan 2014 #58

Remind never to visit Italy liskddksil Jan 2014 #2

I hope Sollecito can hightail it out of there flamingdem Jan 2014 #3

Nope atreides1 Jan 2014 #9

This is what we have become now... Demenace Jan 2014 #124

It's a joke Renew Deal Jan 2014 #5

Italy has disgraced itself. madaboutharry Jan 2014 #6

Italian judicial system is the worst joke in Europe nt geek tragedy Jan 2014 #7

I know little detail about this case . . . another_liberal Jan 2014 #10

the complete lack of evidence against her. not a single piece of evidence tying her geek tragedy Jan 2014 #12

The link says her DNA was on the knife. savalez Jan 2014 #16

A commonly used knife that was in her apartment for how long? another_liberal Jan 2014 #19

the victims' DNA wasn't nt geek tragedy Jan 2014 #21

yes, it was. cab67 Jan 2014 #26

And the knife in question wasn't actually the murder weapon. That was made clear by StevieM Jan 2014 #32

It was a knife in her boyfriend's apartment then . . . another_liberal Jan 2014 #47

I will advice you check for yourself what the details are... Demenace Jan 2014 #127

Because she's pretty? I can't figure that out either. closeupready Jan 2014 #13

Because there's no evidence and every theory the prosecution has offered geek tragedy Jan 2014 #22

Oh...so you're fond of the Italian justice system? Chakab Jan 2014 #24

OJ Simpson. closeupready Jan 2014 #30

You think that rich assholes getting away with murder is unique to American jurisprudence Chakab Jan 2014 #40

OJ Simpson? sked14 Jan 2014 #42

He is indeed, while Nicole Brown Simpson's murderer remains at large. closeupready Jan 2014 #46

And of course, as soon as he's released, sked14 Jan 2014 #48

And The Zimpig JustAnotherGen Jan 2014 #102

that's one of the reasons she was CONVICTED maxsolomon Jan 2014 #25

Absolutely agreed. This is nothing more than sexual violence (eom) StevieM Jan 2014 #50

Maybe because there's not a shred of of evidence against her, sked14 Jan 2014 #34

The typical American attitude to dismiss that which it cannot understand... Demenace Jan 2014 #131

Thank you. closeupready Jan 2014 #149

Sweet Jesus I'm tired of that deflection. maxsolomon Jan 2014 #183

The DNA was tainted, sked14 Jan 2014 #17

in fact she wasnt even there. u forgot that one leftyohiolib Jan 2014 #122

Maybe you should do some research into the farce of a case that police built against her and the Chakab Jan 2014 #18

Hmmmm? another_liberal Jan 2014 #45

I'm a criminal defense attorney who can read Italian. She's guilty as hell. msanthrope Jan 2014 #43

Thanks for the link. another_liberal Jan 2014 #44

Here's a non-hate site to check out, with evidence from scientists and other professionals. pnwmom Jan 2014 #69

Does reading the documents in Italian place Kercher's DNA on the so-called Chakab Jan 2014 #54

I would suggest you read the court documents, and not the tabloids. It reminds me of the OJ msanthrope Jan 2014 #55

Are you fucking kidding me? You do realize that the "court documents" were written by the same Chakab Jan 2014 #64

Exactly. Apparently in Italy the courts prefer the most complicated, unlikely scenarios. pnwmom Jan 2014 #70

Really? Which judge thought that? I was speaking of the judge reports that I think sum up the msanthrope Jan 2014 #90

Is double jeopardy relavent here as some claim ? dipsydoodle Jan 2014 #63

Seriously...I'm not sure. I have not done any legal research, but I think that msanthrope Jan 2014 #77

Thanks dipsydoodle Jan 2014 #92

Most Continental European countries don't have double jeopardy rules anyway Lydia Leftcoast Jan 2014 #138

You may be a criminal defense attorney but you're basing your opinion on lies from a hate site. pnwmom Jan 2014 #67

No..basing my opinion on the judge's reports. I think the DNA evidence msanthrope Jan 2014 #84

On appeal, an independent lab failed to find evidence of Knox's DNA on the murder weapon. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #88

Do you have anything from the actual judge reports...or just tabloids? nt msanthrope Jan 2014 #95

I have the Hellmann report right here... Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #96

Hellman was overruled and retired due to infirmity...can you cite something more msanthrope Jan 2014 #98

Excepting the possibility that you have the report overruling Hellmann... Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #100

Did you realize that Judge Massei allowed the prosecution to withhold lab reports from the defense? pnwmom Jan 2014 #89

Kindly cite what you are claiming...since Hellman was overruled and is now retired, can you msanthrope Jan 2014 #97

The experts in the second trial, professors in forensics at a top university, gave the most recent pnwmom Jan 2014 #106

you know, i don't believe you maxsolomon Jan 2014 #72

I will tell you what I've told other posters..since I've previously claimed to be an Obama msanthrope Jan 2014 #79

michelle bachmann is an attorney as well maxsolomon Jan 2014 #82

Backing down already???nt msanthrope Jan 2014 #85

if that's what you call it maxsolomon Jan 2014 #91

She wasn't granted a lawyer, she was verbally and physically abused by police... Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #83

I don't think your summation of the facts is correct. Could you cite the court record they are msanthrope Jan 2014 #87

Why don't you cite your claims first. The link you provided is dead. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #93

I agree with the standing verdict. If you claim otherwise, it is up to you to prove why msanthrope Jan 2014 #99

It's fine to agree with the standing verdict assuming you have the ruling. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #101

Still waiting on those reports. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #110

I gave her a link to a court document showing Amanda's statement was excluded from the criminal pnwmom Jan 2014 #129

Do you really agree with the standing verdict ? Wash. state Desk Jet Jan 2014 #150

Here is a court record showing that Amanda was denied an attorney pnwmom Jan 2014 #128

The link doesn't work for me n/t cpwm17 Jan 2014 #94

And what was their motive for murder? n/t MicaelS Jan 2014 #147

The small bedroom where Meredith was murdered was covered in blood, pnwmom Jan 2014 #66

If that is all true . . . another_liberal Jan 2014 #166

It is true. That is why the first appeals court pnwmom Jan 2014 #170

I do not follow this case at all, so I don't know most of the details, 6000eliot Jan 2014 #161

I don't think Knox will ever have to go back sharp_stick Jan 2014 #11

Yes, granting extradition is done only if consistent with due process rights jberryhill Jan 2014 #28

But she won't be able to travel to other countries with treaties closeupready Jan 2014 #39

She's been found guilty under Italian law dipsydoodle Jan 2014 #51

"Strange strange legal system they have over there." Nihil Jan 2014 #168

I meant strange as in sharp_stick Jan 2014 #171

I have no confidence in the Italian justice system Gothmog Jan 2014 #14

Absolutely ridiculous. Chakab Jan 2014 #15

They do realize they are wasting their time right? bluestateguy Jan 2014 #20

I dont know..the Snowden ordeal is a wake-up call over how much America loves these treaties davidn3600 Jan 2014 #31

there is zero chance the DoJ will extradite her over this clown court's ruling nt geek tragedy Jan 2014 #41

So openly violate the treaty? davidn3600 Jan 2014 #62

double jeopardy. And, the opinion of voters here certainly outweighs geek tragedy Jan 2014 #65

Italy has been known not to comply in cases of extradition... TeeYiYi Jan 2014 #68

Italian justice system is a joke rollin74 Jan 2014 #27

This is disgraceful. Their innocence is beyond dispute. (eom) StevieM Jan 2014 #29

Of course they did. bravenak Jan 2014 #36

Clearly. Dr. Strange Jan 2014 #37

Glad we cleared that up. bravenak Jan 2014 #38

The arrogance displayed here is shameful. SurfingScientist Jan 2014 #49

So how many times should a person face trial .. MicaelS Jan 2014 #52

The first appeal was set aside by the Court of Cassation. dipsydoodle Jan 2014 #104

So, let me get this straight. bravenak Jan 2014 #53

Sadly, the poop theory makes much more sense than the original one about Knox murdering Kercher Chakab Jan 2014 #56

It's been blowing my mind since the verdict. bravenak Jan 2014 #78

My reaction has nothing to do with the location of the court. cab67 Jan 2014 #57

I choose to not believe in not-in-evidence satanic sex cults. Starry Messenger Jan 2014 #75

The prosecutor is obsessed with satanic sex cults mainer Jan 2014 #178

It wasn't a travesty because it was an Italian court. pnwmom Jan 2014 #86

A small point JustAnotherGen Jan 2014 #117

I hope she isn't extradited, but I'm not confident. And what about Raffaele? pnwmom Jan 2014 #119

He's an Italian citizen JustAnotherGen Jan 2014 #126

It's a diversion to you but not to those whose lives are involved. pnwmom Jan 2014 #130

She's not suffering though JustAnotherGen Jan 2014 #135

YOU HAVE NO IDEA. She has a realistic fear of being extradited. pnwmom Jan 2014 #142

The Kerchers seem like they will believe whatever the system tells them to believe davidn3600 Jan 2014 #152

I would like to think that the twelve million dollar lawsuit they filed has nothing to do with it. pnwmom Jan 2014 #153

Wait - advance? JustAnotherGen Jan 2014 #160

She wrote a book and even had a book tour. It didn't have any affect on the trial. pnwmom Jan 2014 #162

Ahhh - I see - look at this - JustAnotherGen Jan 2014 #164

She has already begun. pnwmom Jan 2014 #165

Good for her! JustAnotherGen Jan 2014 #167

Thats it in a nut shell. Wash. state Desk Jet Jan 2014 #157

Only a third of us have passports JustAnotherGen Jan 2014 #158

It is about the murder victim Meredith Kercher Wash. state Desk Jet Jan 2014 #163

Never set foot in Florida again? tavernier Jan 2014 #175

Naaah JustAnotherGen Jan 2014 #176

Here is a line I bet you've never heard before: tavernier Jan 2014 #179

No JustAnotherGen Jan 2014 #181

This is nothing more than sexual violence (eom) StevieM Jan 2014 #105

"I'd expect better from a progressive forum." brentspeak Jan 2014 #154

Double jeopardy. Knox is safe from extradition. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #59

I have to wonder... TeeYiYi Jan 2014 #61

Ir's all about trying to save face.....eon mrmpa Jan 2014 #73

I will be in eastern Tuscany in March on an art intensive study... CTyankee Jan 2014 #76

Given the quality of the US judiciary system (death penalty, ridiculous imprisonment Mass Jan 2014 #103

Seems to me that someone who cares about justice... Dr. Strange Jan 2014 #107

We haven't had a witch trial in a while. Nor have we convicted geologists of manslaughter pnwmom Jan 2014 #108

Nor have we painted the Mona Lisa or sculpted the David... CTyankee Jan 2014 #112

That doesn't make up for their inquisitorial justice system. n/t pnwmom Jan 2014 #115

Not saying that it does. But if we are making a comparison between cultures and histories we CTyankee Jan 2014 #118

Yes, we had the Salem witch trials. It's time for Italy to move at least into the 20th century, pnwmom Jan 2014 #120

From what I have read, I have to agree with you on your point about scientifc procedures... CTyankee Jan 2014 #125

Not that such a conviction is even relevant to this case... Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #114

Not true. They were convicted for not saying there was an increased risk of an earthquake pnwmom Jan 2014 #116

Well, executing prisoners is not my idea of a just society, but if it fits you. Mass Jan 2014 #151

Read John Douglas' latest book. He shreds the prosecution's so-called "case." Common Sense Party Jan 2014 #123

I would also add "Monster of Florence" by Douglas Preston mainer Jan 2014 #173

Didn't she blame a black guy? n/t rocktivity Jan 2014 #134

No, the police did. They found his DNA in and around the body and on the murder weapon. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #136

...A police interpreter testified that Amanda seemed relieved rocktivity Jan 2014 #141

Ah I thought you were referring to the one in prison, Guede. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #144

Lumumba initially claimed police brutality, pnwmom Jan 2014 #145

Agreed RedRoses323 Jan 2014 #177

It appears that it was the police that accused Patrick Lumumba of murdering Meredith Kercher cpwm17 Jan 2014 #180

This points up a major difference between Anglo-American and Continental law Lydia Leftcoast Jan 2014 #137

If found guilty, extradition should be routine. mbperrin Jan 2014 #139

There's considerable doubt as to her guilt. It would be insane to extradite her. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #143

She's been convicted in a court of law. mbperrin Jan 2014 #155

That's a disgusting, bullshit, woman-hating argument. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #156

No, I have a sister who used this very method for years to stay out of jail for meth sales. mbperrin Jan 2014 #186

I was hopeful they would win this round davidpdx Jan 2014 #146

Kercher murder: Sollecito 'stopped near border' muriel_volestrangler Jan 2014 #159

The word "stopped" is misleading. He was sleeping with a girlfriend in a hotel pnwmom Jan 2014 #169

And if he were really fleeing, he'd be all the way in Germany mainer Jan 2014 #182

Here's why Italian justice is screwed up: mainer Jan 2014 #185

Court of Cassation deepblue9 Apr 2014 #187