Latest Breaking News

loyalsister

(13,390 posts)

198. They can't prove or disprove the future

Sun Sep 7, 2014, 11:23 PM

Sep 2014

When the policy is initiated, we won't have the facts of the results for a very long time. Their rhetoric seems to me to have nothing to do with proof or facts. Giving them concrete facts gives them an opportunity to distort them. They have claimed Obama behaves like a dictator and they would love to have one more action to distort to back up their claim.

The Democrats can run on reforming congress so that it can be an effective part of the checks and balances and they will not have to defend any recent controversial decisions coming out of the white house.

When candidates have an option to lean on vague slogans and don't have a concrete vote or policy to defend, they are in a better position to use popular talking points.
"Holding them accountable" is a useful one right now.

Obama is giving candidates a chance to not have to run as a reliable presidential supporter. He knows that he is not liked by many people and he doesn't want candidates to be attached to him if it is not to their advantage.

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

211 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

APNEWSBREAK: OBAMA TO DELAY IMMIGRATION ACTION [View all] madville Sep 2014 OP

Better to wait till sfter the elections. hrmjustin Sep 2014 #1

Hopefully it doesn't diminish Hispanic voter turnout in some States madville Sep 2014 #4

In reading the rest of the article, Hispanic leaders are NOT happy riversedge Sep 2014 #6

Yeah, it's gonna be a big problem. The increase in deportations under President Obama mucifer Sep 2014 #7

Why do people think not enforcing a law treestar Sep 2014 #71

It becomes very personal to people whose families are torn apart mucifer Sep 2014 #147

Actually a LOT of them do. 7962 Sep 2014 #176

Why? Don't we trust the voters? Do the right thing and the voters will come. nm rhett o rick Sep 2014 #79

The senate seats are in the south this year so the map is harder. hrmjustin Sep 2014 #84

I say it's a rationalization. Hispanic voters won't be happy and they make up a large rhett o rick Sep 2014 #96

No. the southern seats in this years swing states do not make up a large bloc of voters. hrmjustin Sep 2014 #99

Are you saying that Hispanics don't make up a large bloc of Democrats in the South? nm rhett o rick Sep 2014 #106

Demographicly in the states that have seats up it has less than say hrmjustin Sep 2014 #109

Why should anyone trust people who let Republicans win? treestar Sep 2014 #137

I didn't say a word about trusting republicans. How many Hispanic Democrats' votes will we rhett o rick Sep 2014 #138

Internal polls must indicate a bloodbath. 1st rule of holes: stop digging. 24601 Sep 2014 #153

There seems to be no right and no wrong any more - just elections. And once elected, getting djean111 Sep 2014 #2

You Nailed it....It's been looking like that for awhile now...and this just confirms it... KoKo Sep 2014 #158

disenfranchised reddread Sep 2014 #165

The most accurate post in this thread. former9thward Sep 2014 #162

You are absolutely right. LoisB Sep 2014 #168

This comment is so going on our Group FACEBOOK page.... LovingA2andMI Sep 2014 #171

+1 n/t enigmatic Sep 2014 #186

This is the correct answer. woo me with science Sep 2014 #207

What the hell? demwing Sep 2014 #3

Acting now also activates their base and since most of the swing senate seats hrmjustin Sep 2014 #5

And do you think not acting and kicking the can down the road Sopkoviak Sep 2014 #10

if he did this now we would have likely lost the senate. hrmjustin Sep 2014 #13

If doing the "right thing" is going to lose the Senate Sopkoviak Sep 2014 #17

It is not the right thing to lose. hrmjustin Sep 2014 #18

SOME people that hang around DU .....just DO NOT understand how politics works I'm afraid! VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #19

I get their anger but losing the senate would be a disaster. hrmjustin Sep 2014 #23

EXACTLY.... VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #27

Exactly. hrmjustin Sep 2014 #33

What you're saying isn't true demwing Sep 2014 #45

lol treestar Sep 2014 #65

"Then he has two solid years and Executive Order pen fully loaded with ink" lunamagica Sep 2014 #48

He's done all he can! treestar Sep 2014 #103

it would lead to a 2 year impeachment trial leftyohiolib Sep 2014 #28

Yes. hrmjustin Sep 2014 #31

And so? /nt demwing Sep 2014 #57

They will drag it out. hrmjustin Sep 2014 #59

Democrat Talking Points... LovingA2andMI Sep 2014 #172

exactly. If we lose it would make immigration reform even more difficult, plus all the other issues still_one Sep 2014 #43

How do you get more difficult than "No Chance in Hell"? demwing Sep 2014 #98

Immigration reform will never happen, no matter who is in charge. nt lunamagica Sep 2014 #116

Not to mention... GoCubsGo Sep 2014 #151

hmmm, logic still_one Sep 2014 #154

Sorry hrmjustin but doing the right thing should never be wrong politically. rhett o rick Sep 2014 #86

mistakes were made with the timing but I have to agree with waiting for the elections. hrmjustin Sep 2014 #90

Postponing actions for political reasons makes Democrats look weak and indecisive. nm rhett o rick Sep 2014 #94

Perhaps but it will pass. hrmjustin Sep 2014 #97

Wow. demwing Sep 2014 #100

I am being realistic. hrmjustin Sep 2014 #107

Mark my words lunamagica Sep 2014 #121

I hope you are wrong. hrmjustin Sep 2014 #136

No one will be happier than me if I'm wrong lunamagica Sep 2014 #139

That was Obama's and his staff fault for getting people's hopes up hrmjustin Sep 2014 #140

How about republicans all worked up for nothing hehe :P Sunlei Sep 2014 #142

It opens the door wider for Hillary's Candidacy. She's already laid out her platform.... KoKo Sep 2014 #160

I think she has given up any pretense of supporting the 99%. She knows it's her or rhett o rick Sep 2014 #164

I can already hear the ads AngryAmish Sep 2014 #150

Their base is ALREADY energized demwing Sep 2014 #14

I u derstand your anger but the southern state races are very close. hrmjustin Sep 2014 #15

You are absolutely right WE HAVE to hold the Senate.... VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #22

IF we lose the Senate, it won't be by enough to impeach Obama demwing Sep 2014 #38

You must be dreaming..... VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #39

I am dreaming, which is infinitely better than scheming demwing Sep 2014 #52

None of that is remotely possible treestar Sep 2014 #69

No actually its not..... VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #117

Claiming "the end of Obamacares" is a blatant scare tactic, and UNTRUE demwing Sep 2014 #122

Have you not been paying attention to what the teabaggers talk about? VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #144

Show us the math demwing Sep 2014 #159

I care about what THEY can do too...IF they take the Senate... VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #184

Maybe you just don't know... demwing Sep 2014 #190

UH you are better at Math and Statistics now than 538.com? VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #192

You're either willfully ignoring facts... demwing Sep 2014 #194

The FEAR Factor.... LovingA2andMI Sep 2014 #173

So which are you...Democrat or Republican? VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #185

Good one... LovingA2andMI Sep 2014 #189

figures..."Independent" VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #191

Oh my God... LovingA2andMI Sep 2014 #197

snuffing? VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #204

If You're Not a WHAT? LOL!!! That's Funny!!! LovingA2andMI Sep 2014 #205

and because you are NOT a Democrat...I don't care what you think of me.... VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #211

So there's a concerted "we" you speak for? VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #193

Actually they won't own the Senate. I know that is what our illustrious media would like people to still_one Sep 2014 #56

Exactly. BUT, if we DID lose 2 to 3 seats demwing Sep 2014 #60

You are correct. still_one Sep 2014 #64

Are you referring to this chart over at Real Clear Politics? amandabeech Sep 2014 #179

You are correct, I read it wrong, we have a major issue, it will be an uphill fight, and the only still_one Sep 2014 #180

You are right. GOTV will be crucial. n/t amandabeech Sep 2014 #181

So is throwing in the towel before you even get in the ring... PoutrageFatigue Sep 2014 #210

Some house seats might be impacted but the Senate seats are in states with small hrmjustin Sep 2014 #44

Just catching up on this morning's Meet the Press and believe you're right on the numbers. The 24601 Sep 2014 #182

I agree totelly with everything you said. nt lunamagica Sep 2014 #49

If they want to shoot themselves in the foot they can do so treestar Sep 2014 #68

Seems there is always a rationalization to not do the correct thing. This action rhett o rick Sep 2014 #91

There's no impeachment, not now, not next year, not ever in this presidency. It never was anything 24601 Sep 2014 #155

I agree. I know they can be stupid, but I just dont see 'em being THAT stupid 7962 Sep 2014 #177

our base will not be energized either way treestar Sep 2014 #66

I agree. our base on this is not nearly as fanatical as theirs treestar Sep 2014 #62

The term is azmom Sep 2014 #156

So it's like the 'keep your powder dry' folks on gay rights in 2006/08/10... (nt) The Straight Story Sep 2014 #196

Yep once again Obama is more worried about republicans than his own base bigdarryl Sep 2014 #152

Perpetual election cycle vi5 Sep 2014 #8

Exactly. What about doing what is right? lunamagica Sep 2014 #58

Right? That's an old fashioned notion demwing Sep 2014 #87

Sigh lunamagica Sep 2014 #89

If the Senate is lost then all is lost, why should that keep Hispanic voters away, rather than fire Fred Sanders Sep 2014 #9

Per the article--from Wales he sounded like he would do it on Friday--now today, we riversedge Sep 2014 #11

Nov.is 2 months away. Best to wait,see if we can elect more who care about immigration. Sunlei Sep 2014 #12

Well, I can already see Univision this coming Sunday. Lobo27 Sep 2014 #16

and THAT will be bullshit....are you saying the Hispanic base doesn't understand that? VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #24

No I'm saying I'm hispanic, and this is what they always do. Lobo27 Sep 2014 #25

So ......do they listen? Does everyone believe everything on Fox News? VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #29

And it's looking more and more klie Democrats aren't our feiends either lunamagica Sep 2014 #46

Why didn't they turn up in 2010? treestar Sep 2014 #75

It was done fast enough? lunamagica Sep 2014 #125

Um, four of these years featured a Republican Congress treestar Sep 2014 #131

And two did not. nt lunamagica Sep 2014 #134

So maybe they should have shown up in 2010 as I said treestar Sep 2014 #135

Exactly treestar...exactly.... VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #183

They may not listen now, but if it changes then we're deep shit. Lobo27 Sep 2014 #55

Univision is.... LovingA2andMI Sep 2014 #174

You bet the Obama and the Democrats will get trashed tomorrow on Univision lunamagica Sep 2014 #67

Are you saying the the RW base won't be energized? Sopkoviak Sep 2014 #30

How does THAT make them vote for Republicans? VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #35

Non-citizens can't vote Sopkoviak Sep 2014 #40

Oh COME ON!....That is ridic....THEY Always turn out in the midterms....that is not new VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #42

It won't. They just wont vote lunamagica Sep 2014 #73

Yeah...SOMEONE IS willing to act.....but SOMEONE is not going to RISK that change VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #82

Ha ha ha then that should bring out the ones who can legally vote, i.e. Iliyah Sep 2014 #47

Best to wait until after the election OldRedneck Sep 2014 #20

Good thing is not your family suffering. nt lunamagica Sep 2014 #34

so even if he DID do this now....what do YOU think happens to the legislation once VanillaRhapsody Sep 2014 #37

I want Obama to fullfil the promise he made over 6 years ago lunamagica Sep 2014 #54

Elections are about majorities treestar Sep 2014 #76

How big of him lunamagica Sep 2014 #85

Yes it is big of him, since the law requires otherwise they will be deported treestar Sep 2014 #92

May I remind you that this was supposed to be an issue near and dear to his heart lunamagica Sep 2014 #108

What do you think his promise was? treestar Sep 2014 #129

Oh, really lunamagica Sep 2014 #132

This is a no win situation for the president. Do it and red state Democrats are mad. totodeinhere Sep 2014 #21

This situation existed at the beginning of the summer Savannahmann Sep 2014 #61

Thank you. That is a very thoughtful analysis. You should have been one of the president's totodeinhere Sep 2014 #145

All the red state Dems I know are pro reform Ash_F Sep 2014 #200

What were the president's political advisers thinking then when they advised him to delay? n/t totodeinhere Sep 2014 #202

Maybe they are idiots? Ash_F Sep 2014 #203

Pres O probably do have a viable immigration plan Iliyah Sep 2014 #26

recent a dreamer advocate asked a Republican a ? about why he wants to deport everyone. Sunlei Sep 2014 #77

Exactly it would have passed already but for the Republican House treestar Sep 2014 #80

Yes, 2010 was a disaster for the President and the country. amandabeech Sep 2014 #187

Another broken promise lunamagica Sep 2014 #32

I guess "Dreamers" executive order? Iliyah Sep 2014 #41

If it's so unpopular, maybe he shouldn't do it at all. candelista Sep 2014 #36

Good decision. conservaphobe Sep 2014 #50

No big deal? ForgoTheConsequence Sep 2014 #53

As someone in a conservative state who wants to kick the GOP candidate to the curb... conservaphobe Sep 2014 #63

How many of your family members have been deported? ForgoTheConsequence Sep 2014 #70

Not as many that have struggled as a result of conservative economic policies. conservaphobe Sep 2014 #72

Then don't get mad when they don't show up to support you. ForgoTheConsequence Sep 2014 #78

Who cares - they are shooting themselves in the foot. treestar Sep 2014 #88

Newsflash: There wont be any Amnesty, as for enforcing the laws, didn't you know lunamagica Sep 2014 #95

No you are saying the rest of us should support your needs treestar Sep 2014 #101

He had a dem house for two years lunamagica Sep 2014 #113

No you made it clear you care only about you treestar Sep 2014 #123

SIX YEARS< with no resolution is sight lunamagica Sep 2014 #128

For crying out loud Iliyah Sep 2014 #143

Then your beef is with Nancy Pelosi. Where was the legislation? Tarheel_Dem Sep 2014 #178

You were wrong. ForgoTheConsequence Sep 2014 #105

I can see that. I wish I could say I'm surprised, but I'm not. nt lunamagica Sep 2014 #111

I'm not surprised. ForgoTheConsequence Sep 2014 #114

wrong place lunamagica Sep 2014 #118

It is really insulting lunamagica Sep 2014 #119

Exactly.... LovingA2andMI Sep 2014 #175

Glad you got what you wanted then Ash_F Sep 2014 #201

None. treestar Sep 2014 #83

So brown people should vote Democrat because you said so? ForgoTheConsequence Sep 2014 #112

Brown people should vote Democratic because it's in their best interests? treestar Sep 2014 #124

This is about more than just brown people. Many Hispanics are lilly white. totodeinhere Sep 2014 #146

If their own issues were a big deal to THEM, then they'd treestar Sep 2014 #81

They did and do historically. ForgoTheConsequence Sep 2014 #115

They would have gotten more had they shown up in 2010 treestar Sep 2014 #120

Should? ForgoTheConsequence Sep 2014 #188

I'm a Hispanic who was born here Reter Sep 2014 #169

Indeed. Interesting read. Savannahmann Sep 2014 #163

"This is how politics works" said the white liberal. ForgoTheConsequence Sep 2014 #51

Being brave doesn't always work treestar Sep 2014 #93

Neither does perpetual marginalization. ForgoTheConsequence Sep 2014 #102

So who will they support, the Republicans? treestar Sep 2014 #104

Who knows? ForgoTheConsequence Sep 2014 #110

Nothing stops them from doing that treestar Sep 2014 #127

You just summed up the entirety of the Democratic party platform. vi5 Sep 2014 #126

You are killing me lunamagica Sep 2014 #130

It should be treestar Sep 2014 #133

Who said I have one issue? vi5 Sep 2014 #148

It's not unthinkable that some Hispanics might vote Republican. Remember that totodeinhere Sep 2014 #149

Post removed Post removed Sep 2014 #74

Profile in NOT SO MUCH COURAGE JCMach1 Sep 2014 #141

Profile in collusion. nt woo me with science Sep 2014 #208

Accepting this much anguish to win the election must mean it is important Eagle_Eye Sep 2014 #157

It is possible action could drive up turnout on our side mvd Sep 2014 #161

Pragmatic decision that I don't have to love. nt msanthrope Sep 2014 #166

He's right and the immigration advocates are right loyalsister Sep 2014 #167

The problem is that now the republicans don't even have to prove anything ripcord Sep 2014 #195

They can't prove or disprove the future loyalsister Sep 2014 #198

I think he should adopt far right wing positions on EVERY ISSUE to help us hold the Doctor_J Sep 2014 #170

That'll get them out to the polls! /nt Ash_F Sep 2014 #199

Lies upon lies upon lies. woo me with science Sep 2014 #206

More of that ninth-level ninja mind chess no doubt.... PoutrageFatigue Sep 2014 #209