Health

MineralMan

(151,301 posts)

47. Well, natch!

Fri Dec 23, 2011, 06:03 PM

Dec 2011

Wait. Is that a brand name? It is. It's made by Natural Health Science, Inc. I've seen that name before, I'm sure.

The study in question, it turns out, was done in Italy, apparently. Here's some information, along with a link:

"In this single-blinded, 12-week observational study, researchers from Chieti-Pescara University found nine PycnoQ10-treated patients (out of 32) and three (out of 21) taking placebo improved stable New York Heart Association (NYHA) classifications. Systolic and diastolic pressure as well as heart rate and respiratory rate were significantly lowered with PycnoQ10 (from 139.2 to 133.2 mmHg and 82.3 to 77.3 mmHg, respectively) as compared to the control group (140.3 to 139.5 mmHg and 83.4 to 81.2 mmHg) (P<0.05)."

http://www.naturalproductsinsider.com/news/2011/06/pycnoq10-benefits-heart.aspx

Note that this was a single-blinded study, not the standard double-blind study, and was purely observational, with a very, very small patient sample. Not really a study you'd take to a major journal, I'd think.

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Reversing disease by reading random postings on a message board. [View all] HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 OP

I didn't read through all of the content EvolveOrConvolve Dec 2011 #1

Sure you understand. It's in my sig. The absence of key energy producing/converting enzymes, HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #3

Are you saying rockets are more complicated than the humans? HuckleB Dec 2011 #5

In a way yes... they are much harder to fly for one thing...on the other hand, key energy HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #8

That's quite the convoluted answer, followed by a classic red herring. HuckleB Dec 2011 #9

When you have read the Toxic Metal Syndrome, The Coenzyme Q10 Phenomenon, The Lipoic Acid HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #12

In other words, you believe those who choose to push selected preliminary studies as evidence ... HuckleB Dec 2011 #23

Correlation and Causation trotsky Dec 2011 #10

So it's your goal to get as many people as possible to buy supplements? laconicsax Dec 2011 #6

Goal is to reduce the ridiculous, lower healthcare costs, improve the quality of life for those who HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #13

Well, by making posts with an unrelated subject and message, you're certainly doing something... laconicsax Dec 2011 #19

Your sig promotes someone who appears to be a cholesterol denialist who also rails against vaccines. HuckleB Dec 2011 #11

Rails against vaccines?? I call bullshit.... that is slander in the third degree. I think I'll send HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #16

Thank you for proving my point. HuckleB Dec 2011 #21

+1,000,000,000,000 HuckleB Dec 2011 #4

How do either of those studies have anything to do with your subject? kdmorris Dec 2011 #2

Read the conclusions, the answers are there. n/t HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #17

No, they are not kdmorris Dec 2011 #20

I don't get it. Chemisse Dec 2011 #7

I am pushing so that someone somewhere will do something that gets it prescribed to patients HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #14

I think you need to understand the effect your posts have EvolveOrConvolve Dec 2011 #18

People who work on the medical field know exactly what this stuff means. n'/t HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #28

And? EvolveOrConvolve Dec 2011 #29

Well, the idea is to present some medical language in the hopes of supporting MineralMan Dec 2011 #30

The audience which consists of about 4 people it would seem, can read a conclusion indicating HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #34

I don't mean to give you a hard time and I appreciate your response. Chemisse Dec 2011 #24

If you read my sig and realize that Dr. Sinatra is a cardiologist of probably 40 years or better it HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #15

Thank you for offering another logical fallacy. HuckleB Dec 2011 #22

Tis the season to not see you, fa la la la la I don't see you. n/t HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #27

You must be referring to the Ignore feature. MineralMan Dec 2011 #31

I'm referring to the little strips of sticky notes I have cut and placed on my monitor wherever HB HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #32

Try this: laconicsax Dec 2011 #33

And what will I do with these 300 or so strips of paper?? Here is a conclusion that HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #35

You could grind them up and sell them as supplements. laconicsax Dec 2011 #37

Interesting that you would go there, when this is about helping people find a HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #38

You may find this link interesting: laconicsax Dec 2011 #39

Nope.... you may find this interesting... and realize that the supplements used are the HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #40

9 out of 32! laconicsax Dec 2011 #42

Heh heh heh heh heh heh heh. n/t HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #43

Thats PROOF! Dammit. PROOF! MineralMan Dec 2011 #45

72% didn't respond to treatment! What more could you ask for to show that PycnoQ10 works ? laconicsax Dec 2011 #46

Well, natch! MineralMan Dec 2011 #47

Have you been told that elevated homocysteine levels are a good indicator HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #36

Have you been told that assumptions are a poor way to discuss matters of health? HuckleB Dec 2011 #48

Do you realize that you don't know a thing about the topic at hand? Also you are unwilling to even HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #52

How would you know what I know? HuckleB Dec 2011 #55

Unfortunately, I can't take any doctor at face value kdmorris Dec 2011 #25

Dr. Sinatra is also a web merchant, selling products MineralMan Dec 2011 #26

How conveniently you ignore the printed page right in front of your face. n/t HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #41

I ignore nothing. I did a pretty thorough look at Dr. Sinatra's supplement sales site. MineralMan Dec 2011 #44

Here is the difference in simple layman's terms. HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #49

What are the n values on those studies, 12? laconicsax Dec 2011 #50

Let's see if your math is strong. Say you have 9 people who benefit from a non toxic HysteryDiagnosis Dec 2011 #51

And 73% get no benefit! laconicsax Dec 2011 #53

That study was too small to produce any meaningful data. MineralMan Dec 2011 #54

What makes you think I need things put in "simple, laymen's terms?" MineralMan Dec 2011 #56

The poster in question EvolveOrConvolve Dec 2011 #57

So I understand. Thanks for letting me know. MineralMan Dec 2011 #58

Sorry but anyone who writes on his board something so ridiculous as: LeftishBrit Dec 2011 #59