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2016 Postmortem
In reply to the discussion: It seems clear to me that most supporters of Sanders here at DU would support Clinton, if [View all]Sancho
(9,205 posts)19. I doubt you'll change your mind, but I see some things differently...
Any candidate must earn my support. Being "next in line" or "inevitable" does not earn my vote. Talking about the evils of Wall Street while filling your war chest with piles of their cash does not earn my vote.
After the Koch brothers and friends (Scott Walker, Rick Scott, etc.) proved that BIG money could beat the unions and popular voters - they started to take over. No Democrat has had resources to fight back since the Kennedy's and FDR (who were very progressive). The Clintons figured out how to fight back, but their foundation and PAC's are pretty transparent. Not like the Bushes and Koch's who hide behind shell organizations. Unless we change the law, no Democrat can win with the new money put into the elections unless they raise big bucks. Hillary REPRESENTED NY. She could not, as a Senator, attack her own constituents. Regardless, most retirees, union retirement funds, and international partners do NOT want to dismantle Wall Street.
Hillary and Obama know that putting a few CEO's in jail (like we did with Enron) won't do anything - another clone will step up. Do you really have knowledge that Hillary, who meets with Warren and is "liked" by Sanders is really going to cave to Wall Street any more than Obama? I just read "Sons of Wichita: How the Koch Brothers Became America's Most Powerful and Private Dynasty" by Daniel Schulman. Those are really the enemy to our democracy, not the Clinton's.
Being unwilling to take a stand on TTP does not earn my vote.
Hillary is under oath NOT TO REVEAL what's in the TPP from her days as S0S. It's been reported that she won't sign a trade deal that hurt American jobs. It's also been reported that she and Obama have a deal not to criticize each others' efforts until the primary is over. She said she would take trade deals as they come up one at at time. She has supported some and not supported others. She may have a stand that will be revealed, but the TPP is more of a symbol than reality at this time, because it's not finished and we don't know what's in it. Don't interpret her lack of announcements so far to mean that she doesn't have a position. She probably does.
HRC inspires no such feelings in me. She only inspires dread that once again we will end up with one of the two candidates the Corporate/Media powers that be give us. I'm through with Business As Usual so if HRC wins the White house (which I seriously doubt she can) she may do it with my vote but she will not get my support. I believe you'll find that many progressives feel the same way and that HRC will not inspire the same grass-roots movement that helped President Obama win the White House. This is why I truly believe HRC cannot win the White House and it scares the hell out of me that she may win the Democratic Nomination.
In much of the rest of the country, Hillary is inspiring! 25% of FL was born outside the US. Women all over the sunbelt have been treated as second class on salaries for a long time, and now face crazy medical and choice laws. To women and immigrants from Cl to FL, TX, and even midwestern states, Hillary is the first and only candidate who identifies with them. She will get LOTS of independent and crossover votes from the GOP - who love her stands on a path to citizenship and equal rights for women. Maybe those aren't important in the NE, but it's #1 on issues for millions in middle America. 20 million people with families and kids have been here for years (decades) and can't vote, pay taxes, become lawyers, or anything because they are not citizens. Hillary gets it!
I have two young children and I want to see them grow up in a progressive "Sanders" version of America as opposed to a wall-street determined "Clinton" version.
Since her days in AK, Hillary has been an advocate for day care, preschool, public education, rights for working mothers, and children's medical care. I don't see why anyone with young children wouldn't appreciate those efforts from decades of work. Even the conservative Christians in the Bible belt give the Clinton Foundation credit for the missionary like work it does. Hillary personally has long been a national and international advocate for women, mothers, and education. That precedes her days as a Senator and SOS and now candidate.
In other words, she has been as active for social justice as anyone. My wife and I have almost 40 years as educators. We also have seen lots of good that unions have done in the South where we grew up. Hillary has been a supporter of unions and public schools. Obama has been a disappointment on both.
I would simply ask you to consider if you really know all the facts before dismissing Hilary as a candidate.
http://correctrecord.org/hillary-clinton-and-immigration/
http://correctrecord.org/hillary-clinton-fighting-for-americas-workers/
http://correctrecord.org/hillary-clinton-education-for-girls-futures/
http://correctrecord.org/breaking-glass-womens-economic-empowerment/
http://correctrecord.org/hillary-clinton-a-lifetime-champion-of-income-opportunity-2/
http://correctrecord.org/hillary-clintons-strong-support-of-americorps/
I'm not as convinced that the recent economic crisis "defines" Hillary as much as you do.
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It seems clear to me that most supporters of Sanders here at DU would support Clinton, if [View all]
Cal33
Jun 2015
OP
My guess would be the Clinton supporters, but that still does not answer my question.
Cal33
Jun 2015
#2
I may be wrong, but if I remember correctly, the Clinton supporters were not exactly very friendly
Cal33
Jun 2015
#5
I don't remember having read any Clinton supporter saying they would not vote for Sanders
Cal33
Jun 2015
#13
If you are a Clinton supporter but would vote for Sanders should he win in the Primaries, then
Cal33
Jun 2015
#17
Well, I AM a Hillary fan, and I see boatloads of bile from too many in the Bernie Sanders camp
calimary
Jun 2015
#38
Yes, there are Bernie Sanders hardliners here. I have been debating with one the past several
Cal33
Jun 2015
#48
I hope almost all Democrats will vote for the Democratic candidate come Nov. 2016.
Cal33
Jun 2015
#20
I think Bernie is too decent a person to revert to being an Independent late in the game. He and
Cal33
Jun 2015
#21
A lot of Clinton supporters turned PUMA when Obama got the nod. Did most of them just let off
peacebird
Jun 2015
#28
All I know of it was what I read in the media after Obama got the nom, but a wiki search also brings
peacebird
Jun 2015
#53
Considering the alternative (a Republican crazy no matter which one) Clinton is the only acceptable
rurallib
Jun 2015
#31
No it is not clear most Sanders supporters on this site would support Clinton.
hrmjustin
Jun 2015
#46