2016 Postmortem
In reply to the discussion: Why I DON'T support Bernie for President [View all]cascadiance
(19,537 posts)First of all, just because a given policy of his doesn't ONLY focus on helping POC doesn't make it "wrong". Helping the 99% in general over the 1% in my book is right. And many of his proposals help POC more, and many perhaps those that statistically don't help POC more, but help in general people lower on the economic ladder. That in my book is not WRONG, especially when it serves as an economic stimulus that the country's economy sorely needs that it's not getting when the benefits only go to the rich, that so many politicians are paid to perpetuate. Just about every one of our candidates in both major parties except Bernie Sanders.
1) If college is free, then POC can take advantage of it as much as poor white people (or other races). Now, you say that it is because in K-12 that POC don't get enough education to help them qualify for free college? There's a point there, but you're not making a point that Hillary is supporting helping K-12 kids more than Bernie. And transaction fees on Wall Street is NOT targeted at 401ks or pension funds, but on SPECULATIVE TRADING that has made the rich richer, and everyone else that wants to have legitimate trading where one isn't doing high frequency trading is more of a victim of the price fluctuations, etc. due to that trading when such taxes are not in place. And why limit it to only community college the way Hillary does. If a POC or other person of limited means has the capacity to be able to go to a major college and contribute to research that university is engaged in to make a big difference in the technology that helps drive our economic well-being, WHY should they only be limited to going to community college? You're distorting this point pretty massively, and Bernie has it hands down!
The rest of the world is giving their kids free college and is putting their kids at an advantage over us in so doing. Even India gives their kids free college bachelor's degrees, and even if those schools aren't as highly regarded as ours, they can come over here for a masters and just put their college savings in for a masters degree, and our kids have to pay for both bachelor's degrees and masters degrees, and in high tech fields are likely not to want to invest in that, when the PTB help companies use Indian temporary workers as H-1B employees to be hired instead of Americans at cheaper rates as indentured servants.
So, Sanders is "obvlivious" to programs like Head Start and other pre-school and K-12 programs? Hell, he TAUGHT preschoolers through Head Start back in the 60's when Hillary was a Goldwater Girl!
http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2015/07/bernie-sanders-vermont-119927.html#.VdIx6Sx3khJ
The falsehoods of this OP just continue to build up with its effort of propaganda for Clinton!
You and Clinton obviously want the corporate crowd in banks to be able to gamble with our hard earned money in banks without Glass-Steagall bill protection. I'm sorry, but that is NOT what most Americans want done with their money. You say the problem is the lax regulation of "investment banks and the housing industry". Our home loans shouldn't be bulk sold on Wall Street and subject to the GAMBLING that occurred with them without Glass-Steagall protection that would have kept that from happening, if our home loans weren't being the toys of the gamblers to play with. Why do you like the wealthy class so much? What have they done for you, even if they might be helping Clinton a lot?
So do you REALLY think there's an honest "trade union" in SLAVE LABOR infested Malaysia which is a part of the TPP, and that the race to the bottom corporations that profited from NAFTA and many other trade agreements in that goal that have screwed us won't move to Malaysia for their "bottom" labor force to keep their costs low while their execs can continue to inflate their 300-400/1 ratio of salaries over the average workers that used to be 20-30 to 1 before the Reagan "revolution" that you and Hillary people seem to love so much screwed our economy over with the newer free trade agreements that have inflated our trade deficits and screwed our jobs here. We live in a global economy, but only we aren't doing things to protect our jobs and industry here where other countries are using things like VAT taxes and currency manipulation along with other policies to have them have higher net exports to us, which inflates our trade deficit, and has them now own us more like we are a third world country now than many of them used to be. WHY! It's because so many SUCKERS believe this "free trade" BS that has screwed those that aren't at the top for so many years.
So you really want to also label Martin Luther King to be "inept" like Bernie is for believing in the same way MLK did that "dumb economic equality" is also very important to helping POC with their problems of inequality in our society and needs to be solved along with other forms of inequality faced by POC that Bernie has also fought his life for (A LOT longer than Clinton has) to help fix? If you believe that MLK and Bernie didn't and don't "get it", then I'm sorry but YOU are the one that is clueless! And leave it to you that probably shares those in Seattle's POV that we're all "white supremacists", to push the notion of Bernie being "an old out of touch white guy" to show how you are more concerned about racial division than Bernie is?
So, why is he "completely wrong" (and MLK who basically said the same thing) about classism being a big problem for POC as well? Huh? EXPLAIN! Don't just give cheap judgements!
Bernie Sanders is "clueless" regarding gay rights and gay marriage? NO! YOU are clueless! Here's a link to show why since you don't want to back up your labels of him!
http://www.bustle.com/articles/79951-bernie-sanders-views-on-gay-marriage-show-hes-been-a-supporter-for-a-long-time
So Hillary Clinton has been on board for a "longer time" than Bernie on racial justice? Huh? Really? More of this BS? Where was Hillary when this photo in 1962/63 of Bernie Sanders protesting racial segregation was taken? Maybe getting ready to be a Goldwater Girl then? And you do know that Goldwater opposed the 1964 Civll Rights Act don't you? I wonder why Hillary liked him so much then!
https://medium.com/%40alanschultz/why-choose-bernie-b13982c7c806
2) So, working with even Republicans to get an audit of the Fed done, which HADN'T BEEN DONE BEFORE, is "accomplishing nothing"? How many other progressive Democrats who are trying to get legislation through an obstructionist Republican congress are also "accomplishing nothing"? Just because Hillary didn't have to be in congress when we had the worst times of filibustering by any party, and a Republican majority House doesn't mean she wouldn't have had to deal with the same thing if she were serving in congress then too. More lies!
And it was BLM "representatives" that REFUSED to talk to him AND refused to let him speak at events where others were gathered to hear about things like Social Security, Medicare, and Immigration (Netroots). And you criticize him for that RUDE and completely unconstructive behavior of THEIRS? Hiring Symone Sanders to speak LONG to introduce his rally in Portland BEFORE that event in Seattle isn't exactly "ignoring" BLM is it?
3) So you would rather have voted for "Democrats" like Strom Thurmond, just because they were "Democrats" at the time? HUH? Um... He doesn't DISS Democrats, he CAUCUSES with them! And in my book and many other people's book, he shares viewpoints with the great FDR far more than any other so-called "Democrats" that are registered as such, but have more real homage to Third Way agendas that are rewarding the corporate donors rather than the people that the Democratic Party of the past used to support more!
So, would you rather have a Republican president by him running as an independent instead as you seem to suggest he should do? HUH? I guess that would give you more reason to hate him like you probably do Nader, and any other third party candidate out there, whether or not they really believe more in serving the interests of the people than the currently corporate beholden Democratic Party leadership does. And if you really wanted more views being in the public space through third party candidates running but not risk the Dems losing, then why don't you make a strong point about which candidates support instant runoff voting, which would have that happen?
4. YOU are coming off as a racist when you call him an old white man, dismissing all of his work trying to build a better society for all races and minority views, etc. You are failing trying to label us as such! I'm frankly pretty tired of that crap like so many others are here!
Why don't you try to find an "original" racist comment by ANYONE here supporting Bernie Sanders. If there are any here, it is in response to ORIGINAL racist comments directed at them with no basis at all, like those in Seattle did! If there are any, they are a miniscule minority and they don't speak for solid majority of the rest of us here!