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Congratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!
Democratic Primaries
In reply to the discussion: Just saw that clip of Andrew Yang saying we had interfered with other countries' elections. [View all]Celerity
(43,533 posts)104. The true irony is that we worked to install Yeltsin as President of Russia (this occurred during the
Clinton administration), to a second term (when he was failing badly in the polls) and that led to the cementing of the rise of the oligarchs and the culture of kleptocracy and ultimately to Putin himself (who Yeltsin appointed, first in 1998 to the head of the FSB (successor agency to the KGB) and then to acting Prime Minster in 1999.) The law of unintended consequences plays cruel tricks at times.
The U.S. Needs to Face Up to Its Long History of Election Meddling (The Atlantic Magazine)
Russian electoral interference has renewed the temptation for American leaders to do the same.
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2018/07/the-us-has-a-long-history-of-election-meddling/565538/
snip
What many Russians, but few Americans, know is that 20 years before Russia tried to swing an American presidential election, America tried to swing a presidential election in Russia. The year was 1996. Boris Yeltsin was seeking a second term, and Bill Clinton desperately wanted to help. I want this guy to win so bad, he told Deputy Secretary of State Strobe Talbott, it hurts.
Clinton liked Yeltsin personally. He considered him Russias best hope for embracing democracy and capitalism. And he appreciated Yeltsins acquiescence during NATOs march eastward, into the former Soviet bloc. Unfortunately for Clinton, ordinary Russians appreciated their leader far less. Yeltsins shock-therapy economic reforms had reduced the governments safety net, and produced a spike in unemployment and inflation. Between 1990 and 1994, the average life expectancy among Russian men had dropped by an astonishing six years. When Yeltsin began his reelection campaign in January 1996, his approval rating stood at 6 percent, lower than Stalins.
So the Clinton administration sprang into action. It lobbied the International Monetary Fund to give Russia a $10 billion loan, some of which Yeltsin distributed to woo voters. Upon arriving in a given city, he often announced, My pockets are full. Three American political consultantsincluding Richard Dresner, a veteran of Clintons campaigns in Arkansas went to work on Yeltsins reelection bid. Every week, Dresner sent the White House the Yeltsin campaigns internal polling. And before traveling to meet Yeltsin in April, Clinton asked Dresner what he should say in Moscow to boost his buddys campaign.
It worked. In a stunning turnaround, Yeltsinwho had begun the campaign in last place defeated his communist rival in the elections final round by 13 percentage points. Talbott declared that a number of international observers have judged this to be a free and fair election. But Michael Meadowcroft, a Brit who led the election-observer team of the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe, later claimed there had been widespread voter fraud, which he had been pressured not to expose. In Chechnya, which international observers believe contained fewer than 500,000 adults, one million people voted, and Yeltsindespite prosecuting a brutal war in the regionwon exactly 70 percent. Theyd been bombed out of existence, and there they were all supposedly voting for Yeltsin, exclaimed Meadowcroft. Its like what happens in Cameroon. Thomas Graham, who served as the chief political analyst at the U.S. embassy in Moscow during the campaign, later conceded that Clinton officials knew the election wasnt truly fair. This was a classic case, he admitted, of the ends justifying the means.
snip
It was openly hailed here in the US:
Time Magazine
July 15, 1996
http://content.time.com/time/covers/0,16641,19960715,00.html
Yanks to the rescue: Times not-so secret story of how Americans helped Yeltsin win 1996 presidential election
https://off-guardian.org/2018/02/19/yanks-to-the-rescue-times-not-so-secret-story-of-how-american-advisers-helped-yeltsin-win-the-1996-presidential-election/
Hollywood even made a 2003 movie with Jeff Goldblum about it:
Spinning Boris
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0324619/
Russian political elite hires American consultants to help with President Yeltsin's re-election campaign when his approval rating is down to single digits.
Director: Roger Spottiswoode
Writers: Yuri Zeltser, Grace Cary Bickley (as Cary Bickley)
Stars: Jeff Goldblum, Anthony LaPaglia, Liev Schreiber
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
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Just saw that clip of Andrew Yang saying we had interfered with other countries' elections. [View all]
pnwmom
Oct 2019
OP
He had no answer and he totally evaded and clearly could not answer and had no example to give
Pachamama
Oct 2019
#1
Yeah, it seemed like he was just winging it, because he made the comment in the debate
pnwmom
Oct 2019
#3
Then it could be argued that it was a pretty stupid move to repeat Trump talking pats of
Pachamama
Oct 2019
#139
I was *very* unimpressed with his answer to Rachel's question about that.
The Velveteen Ocelot
Oct 2019
#2
Your posts are on point too. Glad to see a few of us know some of the history of our...
brush
Oct 2019
#144
Did we invade their elections systems? How is it we "made sure" they didn't win elections? n/t
pnwmom
Oct 2019
#7
Then that's what Yang should have said, instead of evading the question.
The Velveteen Ocelot
Oct 2019
#19
Maybe he didn't want to throw our mistakes in our face. He said, this hemisphere. Yikes!
Karadeniz
Oct 2019
#10
Or he was just shooting from the hip, spouting off stuff he assumed everyone agreed with.
pnwmom
Oct 2019
#17
The US has a long history or interfering in other's elections, for pete's sake!!...
pangaia
Oct 2019
#15
Not like what Russia did to us, with Trump's help. Where did we break into voting systems
pnwmom
Oct 2019
#18
You're so right. The list is too long, and those are only the ones we know of.
alwaysinasnit
Oct 2019
#27
No, it doesn't. You're suggesting a moral equivalence between Russia and the US.
pnwmom
Oct 2019
#98
there are many ways to influence an 'election' besides hacking voting machines...
pangaia
Oct 2019
#36
Amazing. And I'll throw in overthrows and assissnations of elected presidents, too.
Kind of Blue
Oct 2019
#90
Undoubtedly some cagey trouble maker made sure Trump said that just to throw a wrench into the works
Judi Lynn
Oct 2019
#92
Under Eisenhower, the US overthrew Iran in 1953, followed by Guatemala, in 1954.
Judi Lynn
Oct 2019
#89
So overthrowing elected leaders and training assassins is not as bad as that?
Bradshaw3
Oct 2019
#45
Lots of tragically under-educated folks with really loud opinions chiming in, it seems.
Decoy of Fenris
Oct 2019
#79
It really puts people who are informed in an awkward spot, as they can't educate someone
Judi Lynn
Oct 2019
#87
Whoa! Breaking into voting systems and registrations lists. How about assassinations
Kind of Blue
Oct 2019
#91
What did we do that was comparable to breaking into registration lists and election systems?
pnwmom
Oct 2019
#44
For Trump to assist an enemy of the US to interfere in OUR election was close to treason.
pnwmom
Oct 2019
#62
Some people are much more averse to information that makes them uncomfortable.
Buckeye_Democrat
Oct 2019
#70
Because Trump is using that very argument to justify his helping Russia attack the election.
pnwmom
Oct 2019
#72
Yes, agreed that is the thing. But let's establish facts first about whether
Kind of Blue
Oct 2019
#96
Our aim has been to promote democracy, and yes, especially under R administrations,
pnwmom
Oct 2019
#99
The true irony is that we worked to install Yeltsin as President of Russia (this occurred during the
Celerity
Oct 2019
#104
The Japanese attacked us in Pearl Harbor. If some Americans had helped them attack us,
pnwmom
Oct 2019
#113
I'm till undecided but after that response I know Yang is out of my decision.
blueinredohio
Oct 2019
#114